What's so bad about Roundup?

Discussion in 'Planting, growing, nurturing Plants' started by insipidtoast, Sep 5, 2011.

  1. S.O.P

    S.O.P Moderator

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    I work in a situation in where fellow employees use drum upon drums of Roundup per year.

    I think it's totally unnecessary to be used but I can't stop the machine. I just believe that by the amount I've seen spilled and sprayed everywhere, it could be a lot worse than it is. Everywhere you go in urban centres, Roundup has been there before you.

    Chemicals can kill, Roundup is just another one on that freakishly long list.
     
  2. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    Yesterday I read in my local paper about how a pilot 'accidentally' sprayed 5 paddocks of winter wheat with Roundup in Eastern Oregon, and he claims it was an accident because the wind picked up and drifted it over a larger area then he intended. The pilot ONLY was fined $90,000. Now here is the part that is really scary, on the far side of the 5 paddocks that got accidentally sprayed, 5 more properties suddenly have Roundup poison in the winter wheat fields, but no one can find the source of it.

    The most bewildering thing about all this, the fields that were slated to be sprayed were already dead plants. It was an already harvested winter wheat paddock that the farmer decided wasn't dead enough and had to be sprayed again.
     
  3. palerider

    palerider Junior Member

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    AND, they should keep on spraying until those stumps stop moving!!!
    People are just wierd.!
     
  4. rosco

    rosco Junior Member

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    I know a bloke what knows a bloke that knows this bloke....you know this bloke too.... that sprayed his 200 acre paddock with glyphosphate.

    The conditions were such (topography,weather) were such that the intended paddock received a negligible dose, but his distant neighbour copped the lot. Crop destroyed. Fists were raised and chests were thumped.

    No wind to speak of, just some weirdly freakish inversion thingy. The whole friggin lot ascended, drifted and dropped.

    So Saint Bill reckons tidy is the product of a diseased mind! What a knob. I hate mess. It represents all that is wrong with everything and everyone. When permies showboat their scatty endeavours it guarantees permacultures marginal status will remain just that.

    ...opinion only folks!!!

    ..luv yers.

    :)
     
  5. sweetpea

    sweetpea Junior Member

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    You know, though, Rosco, what may look like a mess to one person, is verdancy to another. Thrift stores are a cacophany of dusty old stuff, or they can be a storehouse of treasures. So to clean up a "mess" look what happened? Many levels of unhappiness, starting at the plant level, going up to human/neighborly levels. Many wrongs do not make a right, even in the name of "tidy". The natural world isn't a mess, it's healthy, productive and finds proper balances for co-habitation. Sounds more reasonable? :)
     
  6. palerider

    palerider Junior Member

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    There's one on every Forum. Usually the same few under different names.
     
  7. j_cornelissen

    j_cornelissen Junior Member

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    onya

    rosco,

    referring to the question asked at the bottom of your mails; yes it is, and you're stirring it beautifully.

    bet you're having a good old laugh whilst people are getting really angry

    onya!!
     
  8. palerider

    palerider Junior Member

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    Don't think they are that angry Corni, They're just used to it. I've been a member of about fifteen forums, There's always one poster who uses the anonymity of forums to just vent.
    There are people in this world who see it as their mission to be the Devil's advocate.
    They wouldn't do it in real life, but the web allows them the distance. Some try for ages until the correct response is achieved.
    They're not usually into the subject of the forum, but look for emotional loopholes to just rev people up.
    Personally, I think it's a cheap shot at people. Anyone can do it, and with more flair.
    So here is mister number 16. Funny that it's always men.
     
  9. Grahame

    Grahame Senior Member

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    Yeah, folks like that don't last here long from my experience because people here mostly don't get cross - we usually answer with level considered responses (on the whole) and for someone dangling bait, that soon becomes boring for them. I can imagine more than a few of the folks here reading some of those posts and just smile knowingly.

    It probably frustrates them that their posts only spur more good debate.
     
  10. eco4560

    eco4560 New Member

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    I don't even think rosco's post is provocative. Some people are just neat freaks. That's OK. All part of the tapestry of life.
     
  11. sweetpea

    sweetpea Junior Member

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    there are surely both types of people. I wasn't angry, and I like discussions and debates. I like getting my thoughts organized (even if my shed isn't!) and making full sentences. It's good brain exercise for me. Hopefully when others read this they get another perspective. :)

    Eco, my sister is a neat freak, and she used to demand that I help her empty out entire rooms so she could clean them stem to stern and replace everything. This was during the summer when I was a little kid and had no choice. To this day I refuse to be overly neat. She lives in a rural place and actually sets fire to her property to "clean up the mess". That's really stupid in California where we have wildfires in the summer. But she's also a control freak. I know fire does set off some seeds that need it to germinate again, but the fact that she's ignoring the mulch potential of that "mess" she sees on the ground is unfortunate and bad land management, considering all the insects, fungi, bacteria and mulch she's taking out at the same time. Can't change her mind, though. Scary.
     
  12. sweetpea

    sweetpea Junior Member

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    there are surely both types of people. I wasn't angry, and I like discussions and debates. I like getting my thoughts organized (even if my shed isn't!) and making full sentences. It's good brain exercise for me. Hopefully when others read this they get another perspective. :)

    Eco, my sister is a neat freak, and she used to demand that I help her empty out entire rooms so she could clean them stem to stern and replace everything. This was during the summer when I was a little kid and had no choice. To this day I refuse to be overly neat. She lives in a rural place and actually sets fire to her property to "clean up the mess". That's really stupid in California where we have wildfires in the summer. But she's also a control freak. I know fire does set off some seeds that need it to germinate again, but the fact that she's ignoring the mulch potential of that "mess" she sees on the ground is unfortunate and bad land management, considering all the insects, fungi, bacteria and mulch she's taking out at the same time. Can't change her mind, though. Scary.
     
  13. palerider

    palerider Junior Member

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    I'm a bit like you Sweetpea. I have had moments of clarity, and cleaned a part of a room say, but i know where everything is.
    I used to have a friend who would say"the state or your room reflects the state of your mind", so I 'spose I'm scattered.
    I hope I never live to see the day when I'm totally organised, then I would worry, something I can't do now.
    I guess that's why poisons go against my reason for growing food. I just don't want that much control over anything.
     
  14. j_cornelissen

    j_cornelissen Junior Member

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    8 pages so far, but we're not angry or taking the bait :rofl:
     
  15. rosco

    rosco Junior Member

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    I couldn't give a fat rats if people get angry....that's their problem and they've lost the argument as far as I'm concerned. I gloss over their posts and tend to the good ones.

    Just to be clear about who I am - I'm nice. Bit shy, bit Scottish, bit of a lair and I live in the Southern Tablelands. Nice place where niceness abounds. It has been said of me that I can be brusque. When I hear that I just king hit em.

    I don't spray glyphosphate around the vegies. I'm careful about the stuff. Don't trust it entirely. I use it sparingly and hardly at all now. Once I have control of a pox, I can mulch and dutch hoe.

    How about that gorse huh? Dreadful stuff. Spose it was one of my antecedents that pined for the old country and thought it a good thing...what a tosser.

    Sweetpea - Love yer work, but this country has inherited a fire dependent eco system which is a product of 40,000 years of fire stick farming. White fella way doesn't suit this eco system so it has changed in many unforeseen ways. If we leave it, it wants to kill us and itself. Burns to a sterilising cinder. If we try and manage it (make it tidy) the hurdles are vast, intensely complicated and offends everyone at some point.

    I like your sister. If she was in these latitudes her pyro bent would be kicking up orchids.

    :)
     
  16. martyn

    martyn Junior Member

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    I use round up because of large infestations of Tussock grass. I can't do anything else, I'm talking 15Ha out of 408Ha of the stuff, and I don't want it seeding the nieghbours and I don't want to get on the wrong side of the weeds inspector. But if you use it very carefully and follow up and remove the weed burden to a managable level. If you do need to spray try using this afterwoulds - I haven't used it yet but I've seen teh results from people who have and it's worth it. https://www.globallandrepair.com.au/products/herbi-safe/
     
  17. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    Lasagna Sheet Mulch, Pigs, Goats, lots of things you can do. Roundup is the one thing you shouldn't do! Just read the links everyone has provided here. It isn't safe in any application what so ever!!!!

    No offense, but I am seriously dumbfounded by this action. Tussock grass is native to your ecosystem and you are fighting against it! The poor birds which eat that bad insects will get no winter proteins from the seeds this year I guess.
     
  18. martyn

    martyn Junior Member

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    Serrated Tussock is in noway native to my environment (South East Australia), it's an import from Argentina, Uruguay, Chile, Peru, Boliva, Paraguay and Brazil. All your methods would work on a small infestation but not large ones. The grass is unpalatable to all types of livestock and wildlife, and it turns whole pastures into monocultures. I have tried goats, sheep and pigs and they wont touch it - even if you cover the stuff in molasses, we've tried for four years to get rid of it using every method - peppering, steam, fire, chipping, mulching, raising fertillity, flooding and ploughing - nothing works. You can't let it go as the seed can last for upto 15 years and you'll be battling it forever. Some times you have to use something you don't like -that's the reality.
     
  19. palerider

    palerider Junior Member

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    Well, you don't sound nice Rosco. On a permaculture forum, and calling the founder of Permaculture a knob.? You've never even met the guy, He'd give you a run for your money.
    Actually, he wouldn't bother with you.
    You sound like you just like shooting your mouth off.
    It's just annoying.
     
  20. rosco

    rosco Junior Member

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    Yer on the horns of a dilemma there Martyn.

    Serrated tussock is evil incarnate....along with a huge swathe of introduced nastiness it's right up there with the worst. Neighbour has spent a fortune on it and still it appears.

    Good luck.
     

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