Discussion in 'Planting, growing, nurturing Plants' started by insipidtoast, Sep 5, 2011.
What a waste of good compost material...
To me round-up is an embodiment of everything that is wrong with society. It represents our disconnection with nature, and thus with our inner selves. It is lazy. It fails to take into consideration the bigger picture. It places us outside of nature. It contributes to over-population. I don't see any use for it that does not directly or indirectly contribute to the human induced degradation of Mother Earth.
And this is all separate from the toxicity issues
I see no redeeming features in it's use.
I don't use it, I just know it's not a good thing.!!!!!
and I spose you sad bunch of hippie scum reckon drying your pets in the microwave is a bad thing too.....
thanks for that Michaelangilica!
Supporting any of Monsanto's products is not taking an consideration to the permaculture ethics of people and earth care.
If it is to be used in the right applications ( even Darren Doherty has admitted to using herbicides twice), use another brand. Monsanto kills babies.
And using a fulvic acid additive will reduce the amount of biocide needed.
Rosco, weeds with bulbs (oxalis, onion weed) can only be killed by starvation. I agree I don't think sifting is an option, far too laborious and time consuming.
The only way to starve the bulbs is to religiously and continually kill or pick the leaves; then the bulbs get no nutrient/energy. Personally I like flame throwers but then I'm a pyromaniac and my wife won't let me have one.
Try painting the leaves with a paint brush dipped in kerosene but you have to keep at it --sometimes for years.
How come the oxalis is a problem for you? Usually it is only a problem for people entering their lawns in the Local Garden Competition.
You could try calling it by one of its other common names -shamrock- and sell it on March 17 ?
Most weeds have uses, it is just we don't know what they are.
I'm with Grahame... well said!
Weeds make great compost, and the chooks(chickens) love them. Poisoning them to kill them is just wasteful. Like someone else said, it goes against basic Permaculture principles.
Bring nothing in, take nothing out, use everything to your advantage.
Not if they're cats....
Anyhow, why not a hypothetical question: Suppose herbicides were not available. What would you do? Do you think maybe you'd search your noggin for a better idea? Or just quit farming because it's too much work?
I originally asked the question because I keep some nursery plants at this one guy's house and he mentioned roundup, and I said "That's no good."
And he rebutted by saying that it breaks down to amino acids, and that there is a lot of paranoia surrounding it.
I think cats should only be dried in solar ovens
I know it breaks down, but only in the prescence of Kaolin particles. If they're not present, it stays viable until it finds clay to bond to.
If anyone tries to tell me it's harmless, and does no damage, I ask them to drink a glass of it. No-one ever has.
Waste of a good heat source, surely?
Michaelangelica - I hate oxalis because I'm a gardener. I collect plants and many of them are small, delicate, lean over or squat down, peering affairs. Alpines mainly. Saxifrage, arums, arisaemas, tiny species bulbs - narcissus, tulipa etc. Weeds (meaning an unwanted, troublesome plant) are anathema to the collector.
I kill them. The trade off for the efficient, safe, judicious use of glyphosphate is marginal in the extreme. Impractical zealots (albeit motivated by the purest of hearts) clearly disagree. A trowel, dutch hoe or kerosene blowtorch wont check the current inexorable march of weeds across the landscape. The McDonaldisation of the biosphere will continue to roll on unless we are prepared to use a wide range of methods. In this herbicides have a valuable and necessary roll to play.
....and just like Monsanto - for brekky I shall tuck into a nice morning fryup of quivering babies livers all washed down with a bucket of bile.
one man's impractical zealotry is another man's sustainable belief it seems yet we both prevail - for now.
"The Dude prevails....."
...is 'The Big Lebowski' the best movie EVER?
Permaculture is Permaculture. There is no such thing as a judicious use of herbicides, because Permaculture relies on using all growing areas for food.
Poisons have no place in the permaculture system.
Part of permaculture is understanding that there is no such thing as a weed, it is either a food source, or a beneficial plant to use to your advantage.
There will always be a divide between the people who use Glyphosate, and the other ones. The argument will never be resolved.
I don't use Glyphosate, because I don't want to eat the residue, other people think it's safe to do so. I won't change their mind, so I just let them eat poison, and say nothing.
He's not growing food though, it's ornamentals, and I'm not sure it's permaculture even without the weedkiller ;-)
Can you please stop posting like that it? (this is the second time in this thread). It's flaming and antisocial.
Thanks for speaking up pebble; the tone's been pretty 'off' sometimes in this thread (no surprise, considering the topic) and I keep thinking I've missed something as some pretty rude stuff has gone uncommented.
Separate names with a comma.