the great bill mollison copyright swindle

Discussion in 'The big picture' started by janahn, Nov 29, 2009.

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  1. janahn

    janahn Junior Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    Hello newcroft,

    to claim that you must complete a PDC to use the word is misleading, espesially when you are attempting to entice business
    when you are making the claim.

    fortunately Bill Mollison's web has ceased making this assertion.

    As to his position regarding the reselling of his curriculum, I believe he has control over that, but that is not the issue at hand.

    LM
     
  2. pebble

    pebble Junior Member

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    copyright

    And multiple editing of past posts will make the thread even more incoherent.
     
  3. Grahame

    Grahame Senior Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    I'm not getting involved.
     
  4. janahn

    janahn Junior Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    no need to delete the whole post, simply the parts I have requested, or the alternative becomes one of justification, I must be able to justify what I have claimed. So then, in the interests of all concerned, I request again that those republished parts be deleted by the moderator. the moderator has the ability and obligation to remove the items that have been republished.

    LM
     
  5. milifestyle

    milifestyle New Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    I believe in the right of Freedom, Autonomy and Open communication.

    We can try to insist someone not belittle someone else in there conversation, but removing the thread would be removing the originators individual Autonomous rights.

    More importantly, it would be better for this thread to turn into a positive reflection of the initial heated debate.

    If another moderator feels the need to delete it, its fine by me. If it were not too impersonal of me to ask, i'd like to find out the ''why'' behind the threads need in the first place ??
     
  6. milifestyle

    milifestyle New Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    Do you want ALL of your quoted remarks removed ?
     
  7. pebble

    pebble Junior Member

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    copyright

    I don't want my posts edited to remove Leo's words. Retroactive widespread editing just renders threads unreadable and even more non-sensical than it already is. May as well remove the whole lot.

    If this were solely a heated debate about a topic I would agree. But it's not. It's both a heated debate about a topic (copyright), AND it's an incoherent series of posts about a situation that exists between Leo and the Mollisons etc. Both aspects contain assertions about the Mollisons that are unsubstantiated and are possible slanderous. THAT doesn't belong on this forum. This isn't just about not wanting people to air their dirty laundry in public, it's about legal liabilities, and it's about personal issues that are unresolvable online.

    I can't see any way to turn this into something positive because the issues are between Leo and people that don't even post here. How can that be worked through here?


    Quite. But given that there have been repeated requests for clarification and Leo hasn't been able to do this, what is the point?
     
  8. bernado soares

    bernado soares Junior Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    I think Leo has settled the matter now,apology and donation to the permaculture research institute for Jordan convergence or for what ever Middle east project they deem worthy certainly seems to be an amicable solution.
    Geoff Lawton has run the institute exceptionaly well and is a man of excellent character and substance.I am sure that the secretary of PRI will be happy to confirm that Leo has indeed deposited his 5000 dollars with the Permaculture research institute.
    Bernado
     
  9. pebble

    pebble Junior Member

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    delete

    I don't believe Leo specified the PRI when he said he would donate.
     
  10. janahn

    janahn Junior Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    which point of relevance do you want clarified

    LM
     
  11. milifestyle

    milifestyle New Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    Might be best clarifying by PM... then post the results here when done... :mrgreen:
     
  12. abdullah

    abdullah Junior Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    incidentally half the population of jordan are palestinians, either displaced by zionist armies, or living where they always did but the border of jordan overtook them 61 years ago.
     
  13. janahn

    janahn Junior Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    I consider this conflict resolved and closed.

    I will continue to work according to the instruction that Bill Mollison gives to all of his students "I encourage you all to go out and start your own Permaculture Institute"

    If any party whishes to re-ignite the debate I am willing to participate. You will however need to obtain confirmation from The Permaculture Institute (Bill Mollison) that somebody has the right to stop somebody else from using the word "Permaculture". There lies the core of this dispute of which I believe I am correct and been unfairly treated.

    Co-incidently when this conflict started I was of the opinion that is was known and accepted by the Mollisons that they could not stop anyone from using the word.

    Best of luck to you all. May you all continue with your good work.
    Leo
    PS

    So until somebody confirms the above, I will take the advice of Lisa, and avoid all people associated with those concerned. I will invest my "settlement" in ventures I consider appropriate. I believe there will be no need for any further correspondence.
     
  14. pebble

    pebble Junior Member

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    Leo, that is the clearest post I have seen from you on this.

    Are you saying that someone has tried to stop you using the word 'Permaculture' when promoting your business?

    If that is true, and you had said that at the start, this might have been a very different conversation.
     
  15. newcroft

    newcroft Junior Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    Why? You've still got a lot of explaining to do. What was the conflict? How was it resolved? And, how about you answer the questions I put to you way back on the first page.

    So, I can only read into this that you believed that PRI or Bill Mollison was stopping you using the word 'Permaculture'. Is this correct? On what basis did you believe that they were stopping you using the word?
    (Again I'm only reading into this because your posts have been so incomplete) It wouldn't be that you run a permaculture business without ever having done a PDC would it? Please, say it ain't so.

    So is this Lisa Mollison? ie THE Lisa Mollison you referred to earlier in the posts (and no I won't repeat what you said)? Why are you now taking advice from her? What people will you avoid? Why would you avoid them?

    So you stated that you will give away $5,000. But are you going to give details? Or are we meant just to 'trust you'?
    (edited for spelling error)
     
  16. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    janahn
    The title of this thread is libelous.
    Please refrain from public, personal attacks on named individuals.
     
  17. pebble

    pebble Junior Member

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    editing

    I've now edited a couple of my posts to remove quotes of Leo that were potentially libellous. I would suggest others do the same. Including you Leo, there is still one of your posts (on page two) that should be removed. You should also change the title of the thread in the first post and all subsequent posts. I think others who have repeated the title should do the same.

    Ma, one concern I have is that the moderators here don't seem to realise that it's not just the person who posts that can be sued, it's the whole site. Forums are a form of publishing, so technically this forum allowing those posts to remain (and probably the title) is akin to having published in a newspaper. No newspaper would ever publish this, or they would be getting very clear legal advice. Once these posts get taken up by google's cache it will be difficult to remove them from the internet.

    I'm not sure what legal liability the moderators themselves have. Given they have the ability to remove this thread and haven't it may be that there is a responsibility in allowing or enabling the libel. I don't know the legals on this, but personally I wouldn't be taking the risk.
     
  18. paradisi

    paradisi Junior Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    and what gives you the right to chase them to the ACCC??

    permaculture is in the macquarie dictionary so therefore is a free to use word

    if you want to describe what you do as permaculture and you dont follow the ethos you are a cheat and a liar

    if you want to proclaim yourself permaculture something or other and havent been acredited again cheat and liar

    whats your agenda janahn?? your inital post was very strange in not includign the reasons behind your agenda
     
  19. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    I think we have had enough of this Free Speech.
     
  20. milifestyle

    milifestyle New Member

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    Re: the great bill mollison copyright swindle

    I'm not a lawyer, by any means. Never been interested in that path.

    Although there has been some explanation given i still don't fully understand what the issue is. I can only guess.

    I can say, that when i visited the Permaculture Design Institute website, my brain didn't click fast enough and i assumed it was somehow connected to the Permaculture Research Institute. It is only in this past week that i realised there was no connection.

    That is what i am guessing the problem is. Either way, there is NO excuse for making public accusations about about any individual or business.
     
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