it is something of a rhetorical question that i feel i know an answer for... it was put to me recently....and i ventured " because they are all hypocritical morons?" .... yet that's not it and i know it....they (Permites) think it's some gardening thing (Permaculture), which it is (now). yet from the conservation and ecological context of Permaculture as 'systems design', one is immediately confronted by the consumptive footprint of meat eating. basically, it is massive, unjustifiable, consumptive excess - lest one is some small holder doing synergistic relationships with animals practising an unusually ethical manner of deriving ones meat. if you are just the average urban monkey getting your meat pre killed and from the butcher you are hitched to a consumptive excess that makes recycling and the like the equivalent of a band-aid on an amputated limb. if any of this is flying over your permie head - let me assure you, as i have been assured, that mainstream meat eating is truly a consumptive excess.... to do with the losses in the conversion of plant based proteins to meat based proteins. like i said, there are exceptions,,,and slow food and synergistic relationships comprise the bulk of these..... (oh, and eating only roadkill, blameless) _______________________ while i have you here; are you a misanthropic bit of human stew who is battling with the ethics of the continuation of your life as such? ( *hug - i love your accuracy but don't despair ),,,,there is a way out without topping yourself .... become the man / woman insider for the animals....turn traitor. it works for me. you can undo lots of humans by just living for the non human earthlings. there is lots of support for this.... it is a lifestyle thing....it has a richness, and makes sense of an otherwise pointless human existence. get in touch with the inner animal, transcend your benighted humanity and be the thorn in the side of comfortable speciesists where ever you may find them (they are frkn everywhere). i believe that misanthropes make the uber animal activists.... leave the stew, start by watching "Earthlings" - which you can do free online. and join the fight,,, along the way you'll encounter many other misanthropes and jaded permacuture designers who have found new reasons and ways to address saving the world.... it is a subtle tweaking of the objectives when what we are saving the earth from is humans. embrace your inner animal, get new license to be a prick, and dam it - if love doesn't come calling. it's real. let me hear your animal noise - give me a haaarrr harrrr harrrr and baby kick some arse. love ya k ps( ya see what happens when ya stop eating meat Helen?,,,when was the last time you heard me wish anyone love?....never: ) meat eating reduces potentially gentle herbivores - to the personalities of cats - pricks, selfish cruel torturers..... i moderate my inclination to extremism by reserving my option to kill cats - after i toss them around for a bit of fun first. vegans - now they are extremists....they can not dig the possibilities of synergistic relationships with bees and chickens for example. but i'm not going to piss on vegans - i appreciate that it takes some extreme 'weight' to counter the massive inertia of the unthinking, violent, cruel, self serving masses of human stew.... it is the same reason i find space for christians and muslims - extremists to counter extremists. too tired for more fun,,,night night.