Renewable Energy: Not Where We're Headed

Discussion in 'The big picture' started by 9anda1f, Aug 11, 2013.

  1. Grasshopper

    Grasshopper Senior Member

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    The exponential growth fantasy relies on lots of "cheap" oil
    Tar sands isnt "cheap" oil.
    The higher price is factored in currently, because it is the minority supply source.
    Give it time and the mathematical reality will kick in and the house of cards will crumble
     
  2. Rick Larson

    Rick Larson Junior Member

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    I think the US has 30 days of oil in storage, but if the government shut down all civilian traffic, it could last quite some time (for the government) I suppose.

    Solar heating collectors are mostly 60-70% efficient, solar electric panels are mostly less than 20% efficient at converting sunlight to electricity. However, solar devices can produce however much energy you can afford to install! No doomsday message in that...

    Oh, if one is worried about buying less beer and chips because the cost of energy is increasing, I guess this could become a doomsday message right quick!:)
     
  3. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    No one has even touched on passive solar.
     
  4. Donkey32

    Donkey32 Junior Member

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    I had a computer/network glitch.. Thought I'd lost that earlier post entirely, turns out it got posted half done... Ah, well.

    We actually never stopped exporting oil and oil products, it just wasn't enough to write home about. Compared to the big global producers, the US is a small-fry. In recent years, the US has increased it's oil production somewhat.. https://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/pet_move_exp_dc_NUS-Z00_mbbl_a.htm
    Most of the worlds oil is trapped in some kind of aggregate (shale, sand, etc), Canada has the largest tar-sands deposits in the continent, but not the ONLY ones.
    It's evidence of what I've been saying here that Canada CAN afford to mine it's tar-sands AT ALL... The energy return over input (EROI) of that stuff is slim to nil.

    Here's another good source of info: https://www.theoildrum.com/
     
  5. Donkey32

    Donkey32 Junior Member

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    Actually, I did mention it.. Back a few, I talked about it.

    No one talks about the fact that excluding Nuclear and Geo-thermal, ALL energy sources are essentially solar. Oil is stored solar energy, wind and water is from solar action, and so on.
     
  6. Rick Larson

    Rick Larson Junior Member

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    Ok then. A play on words.

    The US imports more oil than it exports.
     
  7. Donkey32

    Donkey32 Junior Member

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    Totally...
    Still, we export the crap. Which makes NO SENSE at all, seeing as how we import FAR more.. Why export ANY?
    I dunno but there it is.
     
  8. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    Uhh Donkey, Hi. I live way north of you. Want to read NO SENSE stuff? In Coos Bay OR the giant forests get clear cut to make... ..paper. However we don't make the paper in the US. We take huge trucks all day long, and send them to chipping plants. Then another truck & trucker takes the chips to the port where they are put into supertankers to send to *gasp* China. China then makes the paper and ships it back to the US. Aren't you glad we subsdize this? Aren't you glad these same people we subsidize has logging holdings from Eugene area straight through the border to Arcata, CA.
     
  9. gardenlen

    gardenlen Group for banned users

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    g'day paka,

    same here some of the hardwood they rip out goes to mills as does some of the weed radiata pine(replaced decimated hardwood forests), but most of it believe it or not gets trucked by 'B' double jinkas to the port of brisbane where the chipper is, that is from 200 to 400 kilometer road trip, down full(these blokes need a wide berth on the highway), and return empty(so much for CO2 control hey, no necessity except greed), then sent to asia to be converted to paper etc.,. then shipped back as paper whatever, makes heaps of sense hey, meantime our unemployment rises and taxes keep rising. so same here as USA.

    hurts to see truck loads of hardwood destroyed. getting a bit less now they must be running out, time for the state gov' to sell more state in trust forest to developers.

    len
     
  10. Donkey32

    Donkey32 Junior Member

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    Same story here with the Redwoods, 'cept the last of the giants went away some time ago..

    I love Coquille, by the way. Been teaching up at cobville with Ianto for years. Round halfway through the workshop, I gotta make off to the broiler for some grease and McTarnahans.. Great scene, pack of dirty hippies, partyin it up with the local logger types (and the tweekers). Drag our sorry asses back up the hill to Cobville LATE, up at six the next day to stomp in cold mud again (often in the rain). Good times.
     
  11. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    Ianto rocks.

    Mountain Homestead, amazingly friendly people.

    Next time you are up here let me know, I am on the literal other side of town out towards Riverton.
     
  12. Donkey32

    Donkey32 Junior Member

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    I understand that the US military is one of the biggest users of alternative energy sources in the States.. Seems as though someone high enough in the Pentagon to actually DO some thinking has actually DONE some and came up with the idea that a transition is coming. US mil. is a big BioDiesel user, solar too. There's been talk about using their nuclear ships and subs as hydrogen generators for use in fuel cells.

    The real problem that needs solving is NOT so much how to create energy but how to store it. Batteries are the weakest link of ANY energy system. There is a lot of research being done on batteries all over the world and a few things look promising. Nothing really useful is on the shelf, available and inexpensive enough yet.

    The horror!
     
  13. eco4560

    eco4560 New Member

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    The battle over global warming is all in your head.

     
  14. Unmutual

    Unmutual Junior Member

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    Pretty sure it's because that every time we fight a war in the middle east, it upsets the oil supply, which hinders the military. They're still drab olive green, not real green :p
     
  15. Peter

    Peter Junior Member

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    Get your greens to do something realistic by pushing to have Jatropha curcas recognized as a renewable energy plant not a weed.
     
  16. Grasshopper

    Grasshopper Senior Member

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    Surely your Libs have got it sorted
    Or they wouldn't go wasting our money building the roads for the 21st century
     
  17. ecodharmamark

    ecodharmamark Junior Member

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    According to a Pew survey conducted in March, however, public opinion lags behind the scientific conclusion, with only 69% of those surveyed accepting the view that the earth is warming — and only 1 in 4 Americans see global warming as a major threat. Still, 69% is a solid majority, which begs the question, Why aren’t we doing anything about it?

    Probably, because (by your own equation) 75% don't 'see global warming as a major threat'.
     
  18. Donkey32

    Donkey32 Junior Member

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    Probably because most Americans are aimless, know-nothing, lazy pieces of poo who don't know how to do anything without being specifically told to. The general public is mainly waiting for someone else to take care of it, not wanting the inconvenience or the trouble to do it themselves.
     
  19. Unmutual

    Unmutual Junior Member

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    I'm wrapping up a 4 day environmental study course and I found it amazing how many people are doing something about it, and yes, in the US. There's just no big fanfare or ego stroking involved. I'm also happy that it is very permaculturesque, even if the word isn't used.
     
  20. Donkey32

    Donkey32 Junior Member

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    We Americans are improving somewhat..
    But I tell ya, I do natural building workshops a lot and you can generally pick the Americans out of the crowd pretty easily.. They're usually the ones that need directing, whereas the rest are usually self-starters, they (non-USA) see something that needs doing and do it.
    This is just a tendancy and NOT to say that the Americans who come aren't incredible people.. They just need more -- tending than the rest.
     

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