recycled water - human consumption

saw a new item the other day one of the regional centres in south queensland are gearing up to recycle sewage water for human consumption. they say they need to do this as the drought worsens and the dams dry up and as the towns administrators they are charged with supplying water as part of their agenda so this si the only way they can see to do it.

would you drink it???? :shock: can you imagine the chaos if and when the sytem has a major break down and no man made system is infalable?? :? would the administrators even admit to a break down?

anyhow enough of that there is as i see it a big advantage for the community at large if they drop some of those scare monger hype habits that modern people have been indoctrinated into.

stop wasting good drinking water (if we make the bench mark that treated dam/weir water is good) to flush tiolets especially urine, use all the grey water from the house on gardens get ridf of the lawns and forget about washing the pride and joy car, not to mention those that still hose off pathways etc.,.

turn off all public automatic flushing toilet systems, have more efficient drip type itrrigation systems for public gardens again don't water the public lawns. how many times have you seen water running all over a raodway from council watering programs? what about switching to composting toilets? ther are models that will fit into current house designs.

i heard on a radio report some time ago they say that less than 2% of water (paid for) that comes into a home is actually used for drinking purposes (so there is a lot of potential for waste in the other 98% hey?). work out how much water you need for cooking and washing/bathing etc.,. then put rain water tanks in to supply that need. use baths not showers 100 litres of bath water will bath 2 people, ore 3 or 4 kids, the average shower is going to use around 70 to 100 litres. this water gets bailed out to the gardens, good excercise most of us could use a bit more of that hey

we use a twin tub washer (no i don't believe the vested interest research done by front loader wash machine makers) most people in rural around here use twin tubs we can wash all our weekly wash generally 3 loads in around 100 litres of water which then gets bailed onto gardens. and we make our own washing detergent.

the mind boggles at recycled water and the worst case scenerio, once the water mains are contaminated then what? not even going to go into possible health risks. guess people will buy water from companies who are only filtereing and further treating the water out of the towns mains, and getting good money for it.

just wonder how those that turn their noses up at composting toilets, using grey water and urine on the gardens will cope with this one?

could this be your towns next move?

just some food for thought :!:

len

 

Water Saving

gardenlen
I agree with your sentiments regarding the use of greywater. Here in Perth the government is planning a distilation plant to increase water supply, as well as the pipeline,drain whatever from the North West of the state. We have enough water for the population, theoretically if 80% plus of our drinking water is wasted on lawns (noxious weeds) then we have enough water for 5 times our present population. I am constantly amazed that we live on the driest continent but the government and most people don't regard water as our most precious resource, Makes you wonder doesn't it?

 

Agree with you 100%.here we share the bathwater-dirtiest first-then it is reused for toilet-garden etc and we feel so lucky to have it. But I think the various desaliation and recycling plants will want the communitys to keep a habit of high water over- use as they will be selling it won't they?

 

Water usage

Theres plenty of water around in Aussie and the world what do you mean..I heard that house holders are using 20% of all water used...... So in my book that equates to 80% left for Buisness es.
Comon Len I need to make lotas a money so my chardonay buddies can buy my expensive wines, and i can jump on the free trade gravy train and sell my vegies to Europe. My prime Lamb to Our beloved leaders sworn enemies in various parts of the globe.Also Most Importantly I need The water to cool my super dooper 4wd.
Could i please ask for any spare water to be left in case the need to wash my soon to be swtched on FAN

Tezza

 

Horrible!!
I didn't understood the washing system you described - but all I know is that modern normal washing maschines use MUCH less water than washing by hand. I've got an old one - she uses 58 litres.
As I said bevore- we live in a rented house and since the beginning I thought of changing some things. The washing machine is under the house, it would be easy to use the water. How many of the grey water can I use for my plants? We have an old-fasioned toilet-flush (everytime 11 liter. I talked with a plumer and he said it cannot be changed. But I saw a change set for start-stop. Were can I by this?
I would like to use rainwater. All I saaw until now are sophisticated systems for houseowners. We do not want to spend much money How can I use the storm water economically without having a breed of insects and my children falling in it?
The showering water culd be used as well??
Can this water be used on vegetables?

 

we use all our grey water on veggies

we have a composting toilet ( nature loo ) and a greywater system but accoding to the shire you arent supposed to use the greywater on veggies just run it along ag pipe drains and grow certain plants on it

but since we dont go in for ornamentals we amended the system after shire approval 8)

our house is on a slope so we have disconnected the pipe that should go to the settling tank and run the water down the hill onto tomatoes and fruit trees

it may not work for everyone because soaps and detergents contain lots of nasty chemicals but since we dont use any petroleum based products we have no problems

we also collect rainwater for use in the house but dont drink it because we have so much pollution from the military

talking of wasting water :evil: up here we have the largest potato farm in the southern hemisphere and they have a 45 gigalitre a year water licence ........ this is not good country to grow spuds because it is so dry and wastes a lot of water but they come here to grow spuds for making potato chips because they can slice dry land spuds thinner !

recently our state govt wanted to draw 45 gig a year fom the same aquifer ( the Yarragadee ) to service Perth ( not that I agree with that either )

but there was a huge outcry because it might stress the aquifer :evil: if only they knew how it was being wasted on potato chips up here !

the other stupid thing is that the military training area is over the northern end of the aquifer ......... it is only a matter of time before it gets polluted

I could rant on for hours about how people waste water and dont appreciate its value

I think every house should have to have a rainwater tank ...... yet when a Perth shire proposed this there is an outcry about how it will add $1000 to the cost of a house ! so what people build such ridiculously large houses and waste so much money on stupid status symbol things in them ( another of my pet hates ) so let them build a smaller house

I also think every house should have to have solar panels and supply at least 50% of ther own power :roll: but that is a whole other rant

frosty

 

g'day frosty,

we have a zucchini grower ehre who put in his farm on dry rocky scrub land previously degraded by clear felling and fruit tree farming he takes water from the aquafa to irrigate with, end result our 300 gallon per hour bore now flat out delivering 80 litres at a go. in permaculture i don't think we should be using the aquafa as it realy is a non-renewable resource. we put our bore in as stand by water in the depth of the drought. so we never had any plan to use much of it.

if we as a community have to rely on aquafa water i think we are skatting on thin ice.

g'day hedwig,

as far as i know you should be able to cahnge the cistern tank to a dual flush only trouble is realying on dual flush is no guarantee of wise water use my understanding is the full flush uses something like 12 litres and the 1/2 flush about 8 litres. best way to conserve don't flsh urine for a start.

for the storm water buy a proper water tank they are sealed against insects or frogs getting into it and you don't need to spend heaps set it up as gravity feed and those littel electric submersable pumps aren't very expensive.

our washing machine is called a twin tub it has a spin dryer tub and a washing tub and isn't anything automatic so we can use our water for 3 or 4 loads of washing starting with the celanest and ending with the diritest. there is a push around to promote front loading wash machines would suggest all research is for the vested interests.

os something more to add for those of you who live near a boating paradise and public use boat ramps! while you are paying for water and adhering to restrictions boaties may be using free water at the ramps to flush motors and hose off boats and traliers. how do i know i used to be a boatie good stuff the free water tap.

 

...

 

how much is a water tank and where do I get one?
One thing was really strange to me: when we rented the house, they said to me, that we do not pay water - I think here in Brisbane the water must be much too cheap.

 

...

 

errr, not sure if anyone wants to here any of this...but,
The recycling of water has been around for many years in Europe and apparently a glass of water can pass through 7 sets of kidneys before it is disposed of.I've no idea how they keep track of that.
Having grown up in the UK, i can tell you that the recycled water has, to me anyway, no "bad" taste sure it has added chlorine etc, but many systems have that anyway, recycled or not. I think one part of the treating of the water is with UV light, which is a system available to treat our own water, so i've no idea if that is good or not.
Sure the thought of drinking this treated water is gross, but i do know many countries that don't have the luxury of turning on a tap for water would gladly move to Australia and drink our recycled water.
I totally agree we should all do all we can to use water wisely and after living on rain waters tank for the first time in my life for the last year, i am totally miffed that all houses don't have have them.
But something needs to be done NOW! and i think this is a better idea than desalination (sp?).
ps. Separate issue- anyone heard about Nuclear energy being considered as a good idea? No i'm not joking! It was said to be the best form of energy if we want to cut down greenhouse gases quickly and relatively cheaply!!

 

I think I have to search for something used...
The water in Brisbane tastes yet so ugly!!
I never filtered water bevore, but I do it now.
What to do is so simple! Up with the water price and people will change
their way of using!

 

Hey you guys!!!

I've been out of Oz for a few years now and daydreaming about going back. I'd almost forgotten all the stupid policies re dumping, water tanks, wastage that goes on there... I'll be ticked off before I even get back. It usually takes me a few months to figure out all the stupidity that goes on and start to get on my soap box.

 

drinking meds

:toimonster: :drinkers:
In the county I live in we have a state of the art sewerage treatment plant. Tertiary filtration.

Step one. Settling.
After the 'stuff' comes it is put in a tank where the 'solid' matter settles out. They store this and anerobically store it to get the methane which they use to produce 1/3 of the energy required to run the station. (Monthly PG&E bill: ~200,000--imagine that plus a third more without)

Step 2. bacterial processing.
They introduce a microorganism that consumes all of the nasty diseases and binds the heavy metals.

Step 3. physical fitration.
all of the masses of bacteria and bonded heavy metals are filtered out, creating crystal clear water.

Step 4. UV treatment.
Any left over bacteria is treated with UV Radiation which doesn't kill them but sterilzes them. No clorine is used.

They "dispose" of this treated water 4 different ways. They pipe it into the russian river--they are trying to phase this out because of the excess nitrogen in the water. They give it to farmers. They have established a wetland near the facility. And recently, they have begun to pipe it up into the geysers. Geothermal energy had been an energy source, but it has been in decline since it has been running out of steam, so to speak. Piping our wastewater has addressed the problem.

You could, theoretically, drink this water and not suffer any ill effects. But it's illegal. And you wouldn't want to. There IS a difference between tap and this water. It smells musty :scratch: I think its from the bacteria.

There is a lot of nitrogen in this water, but the main concern with people drinking the water is the amounts of estrogen and prozac, and other pharmiceuticals in the water. To my knowlege they have not figured out a way to get them out. That may be a concern with the recycled water program in Austrailia.

 

yes perception=reality,

they can make the sewerage water look clean, be tasteless & odourless but they can't remove the residues well not at an affordable price. all the residues from chemo-therapy, prescription drugs, industrial waste, hospital waste, low grade radiation waste, plastisizers, jormones (mostly estrogen), dioxins the list is endless. just look at all the chemical residues that go into the sewerage from household product from toothpaste through to shampoo and washing detergent disinfectants. all thes mixed together must make quiet a cocktail hey?

there are many tank manufacturers i'm sure if hegwig if you do a google or similar search for water tanks in queensland you'll find all the companies who amke and install them, don't worry about how far away from yo they are eg.,. bundaberg poly tanks goes all over queensland to deliver tanks as all the companies do. i reckon you'd be far better filtering rainwater that may have some air borne pollutants in it than to drink that other cocktail. so contact all the tank makers and get the best price. get your tank installed first then worry about all the other stuff to go with it.

each community should do an ordit of businesses, schools hospitals and their local council to see where water is being used less than wisely. all parks and gardens should have native plants and need no watering if the grass goes brown or the plants die so be it water is needed for drinking. not flushing toilets and for cleaning. we ahve used bath water in the washing machine this saves heaps best done if bathing occurs immidiately before washing clothes.

putting the price of water up won't do anything those that are wasting it are those that can afford it or can pass the cost on to us, all you do by pricing it higher is make it harder for the poorer people in our community and make more hidden money gains for the authority. eg.,. has pushing the price of cigarettes stopped people from smoking? not from where i stand it hasn't all it has done is make more profit for the companies and more tax gains for the government.

len

 

Frosty:
"...we also collect rainwater for use in the house but dont drink it because we have so much pollution from the military"

Frosty, have you had your rainwater actually tested to see how much & what it's contaminated with? It might be less than you think, esp if the military site is downwind from you (prevailing wind).

"...there is an outcry about how it will add $1000 to the cost of a house"

Sooooo.... if the water were to stop completely, how much would all those homeowners pay THEN for a tankful of rainwater???

Hedwig:
"...best way to conserve don't flsh urine for a start."

The old hippies' water-saving motto: "If it's yellow, let it mellow; if it's brown, flush it down".

"One thing was really strange to me: when we rented the house, they said to me, that we do not pay water - I think here in Brisbane the water must be much too cheap."

That's not necessarily so. Here in the U.S., landlords usually pay for the water to make sure it stays on. I HEAR that it's a safety/firefighting issue. The cost is included in your rent, just as the taxes & insurance are.

Sue

 

Woody:
"...anyone heard about Nuclear energy being considered as a good idea? ... It was said to be the best form of energy if we want to cut down greenhouse gases quickly and relatively cheaply!!"

The only people who call it cheap are the ones who stand to make money on it. First, it uses an immense amount of water for cooling. Second, there are cheaper ways to cut down on greenhouse gases IF everyone INSISTED that companies do it, instead of letting them get away with it. Third, what do you do with the spent reactor material? If you use radioactive material, there is always the debris -- it doesn't just disappear on its own.

It has been said that one of the largest sources of greenhouse gases is said to come from cattle. Whatcha gonna do about that?

I remember a cartoon from about 20 years ago that went something like this: "We make defective cars, defective toys, defective airplane parts, defective helicopters, defective machinery, defective food, defective medications, defective medical equipment and defective buildings, but we make perfectly safe nuclear reactors".

Sue

 

Hi Sue
the problem is finding someone here who can or will test from the right things

there are lots of placexs test for standard heavy metals but when I mention perchlorate or JP8 residue they look at me like I am mad :roll:

then of course there is depleted uranium :shock: we are well within range to get DU nanoparticles and we know the US ships that come here have DU ammo but everyone in authority keeps denying they have it and saying even if they did they wouldnt use it here :evil: yeh have you ever heard of Vieques in Puerto Rico ..........

woody

the nukes people are really jumping on the band waggon saying it will help greenhouse gas emissions but it is just opportunism :evil: there are so many other problems that just cant be solved like disposing of waste

here the debate is really hotting up because WA has large deposits of uranium which so far our state govt will not allow to be mined

we are even getting Johnny Howard ( J Ho ) and his cronies from canberra sticking their bib in :evil: :evil: :evil:

it is quite funny in a WA cause state premier Goef Gallop sent a message of support to an ANAWA ( anti nuclear alliance of WA ) protest held outside a recent conference on nuclear energy held at the Perth convention centre :lol: saying there will be no mining and no nuclear waste dumped in WA

yet when we protest against US ships coming here and spreading nuclear waste ( depleted uranium ) he is threatening us

poor old Geof doesnt know DU is recycled nuclear waste :shock:

frosty

 

Water

I agree that raising the cost of water might have an adverse effect on low income families and not on the conspicuous consumers in our society. What about two meters. One for drinking water at a lower cost and one for water that is used for other purposes? Make the price of the water used for other purposes more costly and limit the amount allowed for this use. If the allocation is used the garden suffers, might have people considering more native plants and if the user ran out because of unwise use then they might start to realise the value of the resource. Thecost of the second meter would be more than covered by the saving of reduced water treatment plants.

 

watermeters are not as cheap and have to be calibrated regulary. That's true. But you can raise energy prizes and water prices and in the same time lower taxes for the poorer.