Growing a fence.

Discussion in 'Planting, growing, nurturing Plants' started by Alex M, May 15, 2006.

  1. Alex M

    Alex M Junior Member

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    Hi everyone. I'm looking for plants that can be used to make animal-proof hedges and fences, but which won't run amok, as does privet.

    In The Global Gardener, Bill Mollison is shown using Euphorbia Tirucalli as a natural fence around an African village. My place, in NSW North Western Slopes, is pretty dry, so that might be a good plant for me. I see it is already found in Australia, so I'd like to hear from anyone who's using hedge plants, particularly Euphorbia tirucalli, but also anything that works well on places like mine.

    I reckon there must be a few native species that would do the job, but it would have to be something that wallabies and goats won't eat.
     
  2. Douglas J.E. Barnes

    Douglas J.E. Barnes Junior Member

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    Where's Scott Meister when I need him?

    If non-native is ok, he and I would enthusiastically say osage orange!

    It's "horse hig, bull strong and hog tight." In other words, it is high enough to prevent a horse from jumping over, strong enough to prevent a bull from charging through and tight and thorny enough to prevent a hog from getting through.

    And, it gives you 32,900,000 Btus per cord. That 's the closest wood to anthracite coal that I think you will ever find. I'll pester Scott to post his report on it on Permaculture Reflections (URL below)
     
  3. ho-hum

    ho-hum New Member

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    Alex,

    Might be a project for you. What length fence are you considering?

    2 links to consider:
    https://www.rainforestinfo.org.au/good_wood/livng_fs.htm
    https://www.anbg.gov.au/flora/index.html

    Some of the hakeas look pretty bulletproof and could handle a chewing anyway.

    A native hedge would probably take some time to establish... 4 or 5 seasons. If you went to a legume like leucena/gleditsia/sesbania this will outgrow the goats and wallabies. Give you good shade and shelter, chop & drop mulch/food and a host of straight poles to infill your fence.

    I would also envisage that hares would be a major source of tree/shrub damage in your area and must be considered.

    You could use the legumes as a shelter belt to establish a grevillea/hakea hedge with the ultimate aim of having no legumes.

    Looking forward to any other suggestions you get...


    floot
     
  4. heuristics

    heuristics Junior Member

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    grow a fence

    I have a small book about growing tagasaste which recommends this using this as a hedge/windbreak...... also has the advantages of chop and drop and fodder feed when cut...
     
  5. Scott A. Meister

    Scott A. Meister Junior Member

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    Osage Orange/

    Hi there...it's Scott Meister. Thanks for the call DJEB...where have I been? I've been busy workin! However, I'll work on getting my Osage Orange/Fuel Tree report up sometime this week...be lookin' for it.

    I would without a doubt recommend Osage Orange (Moraceae Maclura pomifera) if you're going to be planting a hedge...it's also drought tolerant, and was the tree of choice for the Pioneers in the States for hedges...not to mention a valuable hard ood for making tools and for fuel...as DJEB mentions. The fruit of the tree, often called a hedgeapple, also creates great fodder for animals, and squirrels go nuts for it's thousands of seeds (no pun intended). As for an animal barrier or security barrier...it also has thorns.

    Word of caution...it is a slow grower...but I believe coppicing it for hedge should speed up it's growth a bit.

    Keep in mind though...that in the long run...this is going to be one HECK of a hedgerow. I recently went back home to witness the few that still remain in my home of Nebraska...and they are very hard to penetrate, even for humans.

    There's a lot more to this tree, and it's in my report which I promise to post by the end of this week...unfortunately...I have to go to work right now...

    Please stay tuned!
     
  6. Loris

    Loris Junior Member

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    Hi there - in Sydney you can grow hedgerows by not limiting yourself to any one species. For instance - put in some of the slower growing ones that you want to try and fill in with bouganvillea which grows quickly and being thorny will form a barrier. Use the old purple one which sends out long canes and keep trimming. Also rugosa roses - the ones that set rose hips - Diggers club sell these for hedging. Again roses which grow on canes. Some berries can be put in there and feel free to plant anything which might infill while you wait for the other things to come on. Feijoas (pineapple guavas) hedge quite well and grow quickly and while they are tropical, I have had some come through nasty frosts with virtually no damage while plants around them frosted. Even low growing carpet roses can be very hardy and can be trimmed with electric hedge trimmer. Try anything once.
     
  7. Alex M

    Alex M Junior Member

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    Douglas, Scott, Heuristics, Floot and Loris, thanks for your responses.

    Can't wait to see Scott's report. Since I don't get out to my place too often, I need a plant that can be left to its own devices for long periods, in poor, thin, sandy soil and low average rainfall (am I being optomistic?).

    Just for starters, Floot, I'm looking to enclose a small home yard; cabin, wash house, vege patch, etc. Whatever works best in there, will be used as much as possible in place of manufactured fencing elsewhere about the place. I have seen a hare out there, and pigs, too. Wallabies are the most prolific, though. Grevilleas and hakeas are a good idea to look into. Can you suggest a legume to get going with?

    Loris, you remind me that guilding and layering (in time and space) are key elements to design. Roses and Bouganivillea might work, but could need more attention than I can give them. Bugger it! Next trip out, I'll put a few things in, and see which survive.

    Still curious about Euphorbia Tirucalli, but. Anyone had any experience with it?
     
  8. barely run

    barely run Junior Member

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    Don't forget the eco tree bags from Green Harvest....they hold 20 litres of water with slow release. bit expensive but if I'd had them over December wouldn't have lost 4 citrus trees and couple of other berries so I'm not planting any more untill I buy some...as water is still intermittent here. both the rain and the dodgy irrigation supply :lol:
    Will also look into those thorny trees....see if their cheaper than the thorny bamboo.
    Cathy
     
  9. Scott A. Meister

    Scott A. Meister Junior Member

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    stacking

    Loris, Alex, and all who've been kind enough to chime in...

    I think it's a very important and good reminder to be thinking in terms of stacks and layers. Speaking of which...I wonder if blueberries might be handy in tossing into a hedge mix. I just read a book called "Noah's Garden: Restoring the Ecology Of Our Own Back Yards" by Sara Stein...and she goes on for quite a bit on the hardiness, friendliness (to other plants) and tolerance of the various blueberries...she also goes into a bit of detail regarding various successful understory groupings of them with other plants. However...they need a load of water, so a really deep deep deep mulch is going to be needed if you're concerned about drought and leaving them for long periods. It might be interesting to see how these would get along in tightly knit hedge...

    I was also looking through the Designers Manual recently and Bill mentioned Salal (Gaultheria Shallon) that might be an interesting addition to a hedge...partial to deep shade tolerant, provides fruit as well as tea leaves...is hardy to zone 5, and grows into a .2-5 meter evergreen shrub.

    Having said all this...I should get back to finishing that report...be looking for something sometime tomorrow.
     
  10. Scott A. Meister

    Scott A. Meister Junior Member

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    The Report

    Whew! The above mentioned report is finished and posted at...

    https://permaculturetokyo.blogspot.com/

    Keep in mind this report is focused on fuel sources...but since Osage Orange is number one...I go into quite a bit of detail on it's other uses secifically as a hedge. Quite an interesting tree, and I hope you all enjoy the report!
     
  11. ho-hum

    ho-hum New Member

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    WHO SAID BOUGANVILLEA?????



    [runs round forum screaming insanely]


    :supz: :geek: :knob: :nike: :toothy3:
     
  12. Richard on Maui

    Richard on Maui Junior Member

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    mulberry, elderberry, figs, moringa are a few things I am trying to get going as chook fences... hell, I even bunged in a row of seedling custard apples!
     
  13. Alex M

    Alex M Junior Member

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    That's a great report, Scott. Osage Orange is mentioned on a weed warning list in my area, which means I shouldn't have too much trouble finding some!

    Even if it's not a goer on my site, I have a friend who's looking for just that sort of thing. I think his soil and climate would be ideal, so I'll pass your report on.

    Richard, the idea of an edible fence is very apealling, and I suppose almost anything can be espaliered along a wire or string, to make a lattice for other climbers to grow on, eh? But as I write, I remember that if I like to eat it, so will the wallabies. Hmmm.

    Barely Run, I heard that the absorbant crystals they put in disposable nappies is great stuff to put in the bottom of a tree-planting hole; holds a lot of liquid for slow release. I suppose used nappies come with their own manure, too, :oops: . I think Jim Lovelock suggested that manufactureres should put seeds in these things at the factory! Now there's a marketing angle! "New Smudge brand nappies with apples and pears!" :lol: https://arago4.tnw.utwente.nl/stonedead/ ... ketch.html

    I just realised I've been thinking in terms of the rectalinear paradigm that we're all too familiar with, but I don't need to enclose a square; a free-form home yard is a much nicer idea. Thinking outside of the box.... :D
     
  14. ho-hum

    ho-hum New Member

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    Alex,

    Tea would make a pretty hedge for round the front and it has such beautiful flowers too. Should do nicely in that area. I also found that osage thing on a northern NSW weed site.

    Elephants eat tea sometimes I dunno about wallabies... :shock:

    floot
     
  15. Alex M

    Alex M Junior Member

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    Actually, sharing tea with the wallabies sounds like a civilised kind of thing to do. :lol:
     
  16. Scott A. Meister

    Scott A. Meister Junior Member

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    Blessed are the weeds...and babies

    Wow...Osage Orange is a weed in your area...what a blessed weed to have!

    This thread is giving me lots of ideas for a design I'm currently doing...edible, free-form, multi-storied, security fence with pre-seeded diapers planted with the trees...beautiful...now...does anybody have a baby I can borrow for a few days?

    Oh...here's an idea...why not just feed the kid all kinds of seeds!!! What they don't process...comes out pre-fertilized and ready to rip! :lol: :lol: :lol:
     
  17. Alex M

    Alex M Junior Member

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    Some sewage treatment plants in the Blue Mountains used to dump partially treated sewage straight out into the bush. Guess what grew around them? Tomatoes and tobacco plants where pretty common at one site. :oops:
     
  18. Scott A. Meister

    Scott A. Meister Junior Member

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    tomatoes

    yeah...I remember hearing something about a restaurant in south america somewhere. The owner had a toilet or something out in the back, that was basically just a trench that flowed downhill behind it. The trench and surrounding areas were full of tomatoes...whenever the chef needed a tomato...guess where he got it from!
     
  19. tomintaz.

    tomintaz. Junior Member

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    More growing options for hedge

    More options for growing dry zones

    We're building a hedge to protect our wallabies down here in on our property - to save our vast amount of veggies.

    The species you should also consider are:

    All the berries being
    - loganberry (aka. boesenberry)
    - black, blue, raspberry, bilberry, waxberry, white & black mullbery, elderberry, cranberry,
    - *Amelanchier* - Serviceberry (aka. Juneberry)incl. Apple Serviceberry.
    - *Snowy Mespilus*

    Protective only
    - Hawthorn (it's very thorny - grows rampant)
    - Mesquites (aka. Leguminosae)

    More edibles
    - Prickly Pear (fruit tastes excellent) - great cooked, goes well with wallaby !!
    - Olives (will produce friut in 3 yrs)
    - Hazel (to provide nuts) the easiest of ALL the nuts to grow :wink: + hazel stems are strong/supple - great for basketry

    NOTE: plant 3-5 m apart @ least 10% should be of cross pollination variety

    In between the hazel interplant the many berries, bamboo and peanuts (eat the shoots) [/b]
     
  20. Scott A. Meister

    Scott A. Meister Junior Member

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    Tomintaz!

    Hey Tom!

    I thought I recognized that name! Great info addition...I've been pouring over the Permaculture Info Web lookin' at a lot of those same plants...Hawthorn is an excellent suggestion (aside from perhaps how rampant it can get), I've seen some beautiful hedges from that on-line, but unfortunately none that I can remember state-side. *Snowy Mespilus*...that's a new one on me...I'm gonna have to go check that out now.

    Hope things are treatin' you well in Taz m'man!

    Take care! And keep up the good work!

    -Scottie
     

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