Gluten intollerance or Roundup?

Discussion in 'The big picture' started by Try Reason, Feb 29, 2012.

  1. Try Reason

    Try Reason Junior Member

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    Have been hearing whisperings that a lot of gut symptoms put down to gluten intollerance (not that I'm denying it exists) is actually due to the current widespread use of roundup on wheat, rye and barley crops (all of which happen to be the big gluten crops). Those who seek legumes and rice as an alternative are not only avoiding gluten but also high concentrations of glyphosates which would presumably or apparently still be in the final gluten rich product.

    Any thoughts on the validity of this?
     
  2. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    i would be interested to hear more about this hypothesis too
    Diagnosis of celiac disease is not easy and “Gluten sensitivity” may be a separate condition from celiac disease, yet no clear definition or diagnosis exists.

    Celiac disease is certainly on the rise and some say this is not just due to better diagnosis Celiac disease estimates vary from 6% of the population with the higher rates being prevalent in some ethnic groups

    I note Kellogg is about to enter the gluten free cereal market
    There is some suggestion that wheat sensitivity could be due to the extreme genetic modification of modern seed and or extreme processing. (The smaller particle size of the wheat makes it easier to absorb (acts more like white sugar)
     
  3. Try Reason

    Try Reason Junior Member

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    Yes, seems the most likely culprit is the refined product which our genetics has not entirely evolved to cope with. Aside from the more modern prevalence of how they refine wheat we do indeed have grains with far more gluten content now than over the previous thousands of years of cereal cropping. As far as I'm aware this is through selective breeding and not GM. This pretty much means more gluten products around per person than before exposing vulnerabilities that may have gone unnoticed once.

    In keeping with the modern agriculture theme, what about modern fertilizer? How does this effect plant nutrients and in turn, our digestion of these plants?

    The other recent thing is the use of glyphosates on crop land which is quickly turning into the new "roundup ready" cropping which will increase prevalence massively. Apparently roundup ready wheat is still in the trial phase. There is pretty much a program to "roundup ready" all broadacre crops. Even someone who wasn't concerned about the possible immediate human health consequences of this should be a little unnerved by what this prospect holds in store. Back to how it effects our food, I've not found much in the way of study but more critiques of studies by Monsanto for their vague descriptions of results on lab animals. Also a few cases of scientific fraud and subsequent assurances that everything is fine in retesting. Until I find an indepentant study that shows an alternative view to the "eat up, a little bit here and there is fine" then I wont be satisfied though. Consensus seems to be that glyphosate concentrates in bones and internal organs over time. No one knows what the long term effects of this will be. Nothing found on effects on animal digestion or guts yet.
     
  4. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    Most recently pregnant women; here are just a couple of GScholar articles on it
    https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0890623811000566
    elevated risk of abortion:-
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1240415/

    Perhaps not an unbiased source but:-
    Roundup and birth defects
    https://www.scribd.com/doc/57277946/27/The-question-of-doses

    There was an interesting interview on ABC Radio that i caught a little of this morning.(on sex, i learnt a bit too!). The guy talked about how we had evolved in the last 12,000 years to genetically cope with agriculture's more abundant supply of carbohydrates. he said many races without along agricultural history, like Aust Aboriginal, do not have (yet) the mechanisms to cope with a high carbohydrate/sugar diet.
    Sorry can't find the link now ( Mornings with Margaret Throsby?) but i did find this while I was looking:-
    https://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/latenightlive/are-gmos-safe3f/3858030
     
  5. S.O.P

    S.O.P Moderator

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    And, any person put on a round of antibiotics loses gut flora, both good and bad.

    So much so, they are going to start inoculating you with gut flora from another 'clean' source. A third world export, perhaps.

    Sorry, I can't remember where I got that tidbit from, I'll keep looking for a reference.
     
  6. Terra

    Terra Moderator

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    Roundup ready crops aside , roundup is already used on cereal crops , widespread use just as the crop ripens to wipe out herbicide resistant ryegrass which has become a serious problem . So who knows how much we already consume it was never intended for consumption so beats me why someone decided this is ok .
     
  7. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    Gluten sensitivity can come from a host of other areas as well though such as Candida which IMO is why it is important to make sure people have a balanced diet that includes fermented foods.
     
  8. gardenlen

    gardenlen Group for banned users

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    i'm gluten and all grain resistant, whilst i don't believe round up ready crops are not going to add to current health woes of many, and many of those many not getting any help from indoctrinated medical, where you are no longer a patient but a client. there ae no tests fro intolerance or celeac, or any of those lifestyle diseases which all stem from immune system damage at gene's level. had 15 years of trying to get a handle on my health. any doc's who tried researching seem to be shut down, a couple near sydney in their early stages research pointed to chem' residues in grown food.

    with grains they no longer represent the nutritional value they may have had soon after being hybridised fro the wild grain to the many times hybridised grains we have now, all hybridised to suit the farmer and the producer, a friend knows a wheat farmer up this way the farmer knows this, he tries to grow older hybrids for people who can still tolerate grains at all, big thing though the older grains smaller so system does not want them for food. so the farmers know what they grow is no good for health. and the organic rip off only guarantees a higher price.

    gluten intolerance exists but not recognised in main stream medicine.

    so in GMO glyphosate just another residue in a cocktail of residues.

    len
     
  9. Try Reason

    Try Reason Junior Member

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    I wonder if there has been an independant study outside of Monsanto to test the safety of consumption of glyphosate. There's certainly nothing on long term accumulation or exposure. Who indeed did decide it was ok to consume glyphosate? The people on the top rungs of business who love thier business models and would change everything else around it before changing the model. Grease a few political and media cogs and get it legislated or removed from public consciousness.
     
  10. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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  11. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    That is no longer the case; although mainstream medicine has enormous trouble diagnosing coeliac disease.
    And, apart from a strict diet there is no effective treatment
     
  12. S.O.P

    S.O.P Moderator

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  13. frosty

    frosty Junior Member

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    I am gluten intolerant but I only eat Organic .......... its decades since i would have eatn anything that would contain roundup
     
  14. gardenlen

    gardenlen Group for banned users

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    miacael,

    you are somewhat selective in quoting me but that is nothing new around the traps.

    i have in the past 12 years sat across from GP's and all sorts of specialist, and they may recognise the word but they do not want to know about the symptoms because there is no kick back money to be made selling chemical fixes, there is no fix. their best stab was to call some stuff low GI that is not the answer low GI or note once intolerant you get the same reading after eating those grains. seeing an indoctrinate specialist at present he just brushed coeliac aside when i mentioned it. and once affected a strict diet of no grains and little carbohydrates does little.

    and 'try reason', GMO is self regulated and supported by the gov', so there will never be any independent testing done, that's not part of the agenda.

    len
     
  15. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    Yes well most GPs are very limited Most could not diagnose the Black Plague without a Pathology test. The problem with gluten and grain sensitivity is that it is almost impossible to diagnose although new genetic tests are becoming available in the USA. However is is a well recognised medical problem, with as I said up to 6% incidence in the population (I suspect more) you just need to find an intelligent medical practitioner, not an easy task. probably someone a bit alterntive or a specialist gastroenterologist
    i have just written some stuff about it (I too have suffered all my life in the end treating myself) This is an extract from something I recently wrote about it:-
    i supect that once on adiet you become even more sensitive to grains and even the tiniest bit (micrograms) can give you symptoms i suspect much IBS is down to it
    i also supect that mast cell inhibitors could help get you out of trouble while travelling or eating something suspect. Sodium cromogate is the classic, taken orally before ameal (now no longer available) The herb that sodium cromogate originally came from is the weed kella or Ammi visnaga There is no reseach to support my theories.

    Good luck fellow traveller. It is a difficult miserable, often overlooked and under diagnosed complaint which can affect your whole outlook and feeling about life
     
  16. eco4560

    eco4560 New Member

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    For those in Australia - if you are looking for a doctor who actually understands nutrition - try looking at ACNEM for their list of practitioners. That's the Australasian College of Environmental and Nutritional Medicine. Graeme Sait (Nutritech, soil guru) reckons he refers people to ACNEM docs all the time and hasn't found a bad one yet.
     
  17. gardenlen

    gardenlen Group for banned users

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    might be a fellow traveler, but my outlook and feelings on life are sound just how i feel about medico's and their scientific mates all pedaling snake oil, and never going the whole hog

    len
     
  18. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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  19. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    Low amounts of vitamin D, & calcium seem to be a factor in a large amount of medical maladies, makes me wonder about those people who claim you should have your body more base then acidic. I personally wouldn't even know how to check such a thing without expensive tests.
     
  20. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    [video=youtube;wAJAgPitY_Q]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAJAgPitY_Q&feature=player_detailpage[/video]
     

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