Don't BUY into making EM4 or any other EM...

Discussion in 'Planting, growing, nurturing Plants' started by Pakanohida, Aug 19, 2013.

  1. Unmutual

    Unmutual Junior Member

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    You shouldn't use any manure in a producing bed period. Finished compost is fine. I haven't really found much about compost tea as far as getting sick from it. Agricultural practices are to wait X days after applying anything before harvesting. X depends on what you're applying(biocide, fertilizer, what have you). This is probably one of the reasons that gave power to chemical agriculture.
     
  2. mouseinthehouse

    mouseinthehouse Junior Member

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    Have used all sorts of manures (well mainly horse, cow and chook/duck) directly on producing beds for years as have my friends, my boss, my boss's parents and those members of my family who garden including great-grandparents that I remember, my mothers cleaner....etc. etc. Have never heard in 45 years of anyone having a problem. Not saying it doesn't happen but my own observations tell me it is uncommon to have a problem if you wash stuff and cook stuff properly. Then again maybe the bad shit germs will get me tomorrow. Che Sera Sera!
     
  3. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    Yep, & like Mouse, my observations of 30ish years I am more comfortable with.

    Also like Mouse, I use a variety of scats.


    Edit #2, Even Geoff Lawton uses duck water directly in the garden from a well used duck pond in one of his videos.
     
  4. Unmutual

    Unmutual Junior Member

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    That's also part of the key: cleaning, cooking properly, separating meat from veggies when preparing, etc. We've really lost a lot of common knowledge over the last few decades when it comes to food. I don't think that manure will get in to the veggie per se, but it's a surface issue(which could be a bigger problem with something like cauliflower that has a lot of surface area). I'm also not sure if it can be prevented with a good, thick mulch either(rain splatter). However though, here is something about it.

    I'll take my overcautious attitude. It's not a problem until it becomes a problem. There's a reason these outbreaks don't happen all the time and over a larger geographical area, they're rare to begin with.
     
  5. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    Well, for me, the closest thing I use to any of this is "juice" that goes through my worm bed, and that juice is never used on days of harvest. It's more for using on new plant areas, and perennials, food forest area kind of things, and the spreading of earthworms.
     
  6. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    Source?


    I literally googled, "compost tea kills people" and found all the wonderful uses from disease suppression to growth benefits.


    Lastly, I can't imagine anyone who would use compost tea to make sprouts. That's just flat out Darwinian. :)
     
  7. mouseinthehouse

    mouseinthehouse Junior Member

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    Love it! ha ha :)
     
  8. Eugene von Guerard

    Eugene von Guerard Junior Member

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    Tap in, say..... "peer reviewed compost tea" and then take your pick.

    Rick Larson put me on to Linda Chalker-Whites work. She is a good start, but you will find oodles of info out there. Of course, if you are looking for articles that support your world view, you will find them too.
     
  9. Rick Larson

    Rick Larson Junior Member

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    Well, I haven't taken a position against compost tea. However, the warning of the potential danger is important.
     
  10. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    So only obfuscation, no source? :shake:

    Closest negative thing I found was WSU won't condone its use yet due to not enough testing by the scientific community since mostly do is test disease resistance with compost tea & as such can't condone its use for that application at this time.
     
  11. Eugene von Guerard

    Eugene von Guerard Junior Member

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    The more I look into compost teas the less I like it. Was going to do an aerobic kelp/compost/rockdust brew, but not now. Just been looking at more negatives on this here intranet and have come to the conclusion that the whole CT fever is a complete crock and full of shonks. Worse than that it, it is downright dangerous and the benefits are truly marginal.

    Spent time/money/thought in making a gorgeous set up with an old reconstituted steel 55 gallon drum (very retro - got the original shell pegasus type label on it) by scrubbing off the rust and gunk, coating the inside (3 times) with a water based, bitumen compound (pottable quality) then the drum goes on this schmick stand with a beautiful repaired tap and catcher underneath, the whole shebang given a prime spot in my new shed and now....WTF do I do with it? Could make it a worm farm....but....dunno now. No good for kerosene anymore.

    I pride myself on having a nose for junk science. If anyone nice is interested I will post some links.
     
  12. Rick Larson

    Rick Larson Junior Member

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    Post those links.
     
  13. Gonhar

    Gonhar Junior Member

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    Now you have a perfectly usable water catchment drum. Better yet, grow some guppies or goldfish in it and use the water for your plants.

    I believe in "landrace" microorganisms to take care of the soil. Feed the soil, (add compost, mulch, wood chips, grass, green mulch) provide moisture, and let the critters do their thing.
     
  14. Eugene von Guerard

    Eugene von Guerard Junior Member

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    Couldn't agree more Gonhar." Feed the soil" has become my new gardening maxim. I am a recent convert to the subtle nuances that goes on in the soil - the way that plants develop complex relationships with mycorrhizal funghi, chemicals and bacteria is extraordinary and it's good to see the way mainstream agricultural practices have begun to adopt more benign methods as a result.

    I've already got a small aquaponics set up on the go, so my magnificent drum is still looking for a reason.

    Rick - have a look at that link you posted the other day on that other thread. Linda Chalker-White is a font of good info on the topic. Read what she says about the power of mulch versus CT. I would post a link, but would feel like I've been bullied into it by the knobs here, so fuck it - you can all do your own work and reach your own conclusions.

    I'm leaving this place for good now. Had a good look around and I don't like what I see.
     
  15. Rick Larson

    Rick Larson Junior Member

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    Bye bye.
     
  16. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    Aloha (Meaning hello) Rick,

    SOURCE: Right Here.


    Amphibology. it's not the study of amphibians.


    Anyway, Aloha (Good bye)
     
  17. Rick Larson

    Rick Larson Junior Member

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    That is a good idea Pak, I like using fish in compost and three sisters as well.
     
  18. Pakanohida

    Pakanohida Junior Member

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    I try, it's what this post was all about, helping make these things.

    This fertilizer in my grange costs about $10 for 2 cups... I go to the beach and make the same thing for pennies per 5 gallons.
     
  19. FarmerCharlie

    FarmerCharlie New Member

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    Good day, Sir Pakanohida.. thank you for sharing how to make EM-1 to EM-4. but can you please give us more details and please be more specific on what the proportion (in terms of weight or volume) of the materials to be use for making EM-1. Also, regarding the cheap bran(is this rice bran or what kind of bran) do we use here. Will be trying to make my own EM-4 for my backyard garden use.. also what is the dilution if we are going to use EM-4 as foliar application for my vegetable crops? Also the vegetable and fruit peels to be use here have to be chopped or not?
     
  20. sweetpea

    sweetpea Junior Member

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    I thought this recipe sounded a lot like Bokashi, (which just doesn't involve fruit) and this website shows the proportions for the bran/water, etc. Molasses is liquid brown sugar. And instead of the EM1, add fruit peels, rotted fruit.

    https://www.teraganix.com/EM-Bokashi-Recipe-s/262.htm

    So my guess for the proportions (but I bet it's not fussy, as long as the microbes have enough sugar)

    10 cups water (rice rinse water)
    4 Tablespoons molasses (or 3/4 C brown sugar)
    10 pounds of bran (soaked in water not dry)
    Fruit peels, rotted fruit


    This appeals a lot to me because I have crows that come and invade my compost pile digging out the rotted fruit. The bluejays are pecking away at the almost-ripe apples. So I am glad to put these to use.

    Funny that Eugene will eat greens grown in fish poop water (aquaponics) but doesn't like compost tea. :)

    I don't think it gets any better for plants than compost tea, which also happens with very thick leaf mulch over thick compost (which stops the possible splash-up onto lettuce and greens) They do have lettuce recalls often in California when people start getting upset stomachs, they find out that a herd of cattle pooped in the water upstream from the lettuce growers.

    :)
     

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