Did anyone realise we have an Election in August?

Discussion in 'The big picture' started by Tezza, Jul 21, 2010.

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Did anyone realise we have an Election in August?

  1. Greens

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  3. liberal

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  5. independents

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  1. gardenlen

    gardenlen Group for banned users

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    as i have experienced before and in the recent past seems to be those who want to deal in anothers personality, i guess that may be their rite or freedom dunno?? just not good for a healthy forum does tend to keep guests from subscribing can also tear a forum down.

    yes we have freedoms won by our forebears, those freedom start with the right to our own determinations, they also are the rites won to be able to live in our society those are affordable, food, water, power, and yes fuel for vehicles, affordable shelter, medical, aged care and an affordable standard of education across the board not just for the affluent. and yes the rite to vote or not to vote as much as, who we vote for no matter for what reason we are driven.

    len
     
  2. petershaw

    petershaw Junior Member

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    Interesting you use Churchill to support your assertions;
    The same Churchill who was the political and military engineer of the disaster at Gallipoli!
    The same Churchill who was reported to have suggested the use of Machine guns in 1926 on striking British Miners!
    The same Churchill who described Mussolini as the Roman Genius!
    The same Churchill who was a founder of the British Defence League, a group dedicated to thepreservation of British Power in India!
    The same Churchill who suggested allowing Gandhi to die if he went on a hunger strike!, and in defence of that suggestion said; "It is alarming and also nauseating to see Mr Gandhi a seditous middle temple lawyer,now posing as a fakir of atype well known in the east, striding half naked up the steps of the Vice Regal Palace to parley on equal terms with the representative of the King- Emperor".
    Yes a Champion of Democracy!!!!!!
     
  3. ecodharmamark

    ecodharmamark Junior Member

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    Kropotkin's "Anarchism" (from The Encyclopaedia Britannica, 1910)

    ANARCHISM (from the Gr. 'contrary to authority') is the name given to a principle or theory of life and conduct under which society is conceived without government - harmony in such a society being obtained, not by submission to law, or by obedience to any authority, but by free agreements concluded between the various groups, territorial and professional, freely constituted for the sake of production and consumption, as also for the satisfaction of the infinite variety of needs and aspirations of a civilized being. In a society developed on these lines, the voluntary associations which already now begin to cover all the fields of human activity would take a still greater extension so as to substitute themselves for the state in all its functions. They would represent an interwoven network, composed of an infinite variety of groups and federations of all sizes and degrees, local, regional, national and international temporary or more or less permanent - for all possible purposes: production, consumption and exchange, communications, sanitary arrangements, education, mutual protection, defence of the territory, and so on; and, on the other side, for the satisfaction of an ever-increasing number of scientific, artistic, literary and sociable needs. Moreover, such a society would represent nothing immutable. On the contrary - as is seen in organic life at large - harmony would (it is contended) result from an ever-changing adjustment and readjustment of equilibrium between the multitudes of forces and influences, and this adjustment would be the easier to obtain as none of the forces would enjoy a special protection from the state...

    Cheerio, Markos.
     
  4. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    No it is the exact opposite.

    What do you think politics is?
    Can't you do both?
    How much skin off your nose is it to vote? It is not that much of an effort.
    At worst the party you vote for gets a $1 towards their cause be it loony or MJ party or what.
    or
    do you think it shows how cleverer than, and contemptable of the system you are?
    I think it is dumb.

    yes, of course, so what?
    Murdock has been running a one man campaign againt anyone progressive -Obama, Rudd, Labor-- for years, are you going to let him get away with it?



    Then vote! GetUp has made it possible for you
    www.getup.org.au/campaign/thankyou
     
  5. gardenlen

    gardenlen Group for banned users

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    so markos,

    could i say from what you posted we need leadership or leaders and not governances or rulers?

    maybe thatmight lead to all being treated more equal? sounds good actually.

    len
     
  6. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    Romantic and lovely.
    Show me where it works.
     
  7. ecodharmamark

    ecodharmamark Junior Member

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    We'll never know, unless we give it a go, Len. Good luck with whoever you vote for, or not, Markos.
     
  8. gardenlen

    gardenlen Group for banned users

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    ah michael that would be a whole nutha' story hey chuckle.

    mark, whomever any vote for will not bring us anywhere near leadership, they are ALL their for their own importances and rewards aplenty.

    len
     
  9. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    not relevant to the argument at all.
     
  10. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    Yes but if you stood; how differnt would it be?
     
  11. ecodharmamark

    ecodharmamark Junior Member

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    G'day Michael

    It works for me! It can work for anybody, and if enough people get together, it will work for entire communities.

    There have been many examples throughout history where various forms of anarchist society have emerged. Of course, they were all cruelly smashed by the emergent/dominant political paradigm, so-called 'liberal democracy'.

    Some of these examples are:

    The New England Town Meetings before the American Revolution (C17)

    The Spanish Revolution of 1936

    The Paris Communes of 1871 and 1968

    Here's another Churchill quote for you: "History is written by the victors".

    Perhaps this is why we have such a distorted view of history today?

    Cheerio, Markos
     
  12. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    You sadden me Marcos. Please reconsider your decision not to vote.
     
  13. gardenlen

    gardenlen Group for banned users

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    michael,

    i would then become one of them and therefore no more honest or trustworthy than they, the gov' system corrupts. and what i realy think is as i said, we need leaders not rulers. society or the community does not want that as i see it.

    len
     
  14. ecodharmamark

    ecodharmamark Junior Member

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    Ahh, perhaps you missed my earlier posts in this thread (Vote 1 Joseph Toscano) where I declared that I am going to vote?

    I would love to read any response/s you would care to share with us regarding to the above examples of where an anarchist society has worked, Michael.

    Cheerio, my friend, Markos.
     
  15. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    Sorry I miss-read your posts. I am relieved. You have my vote when you want to stand up.

    I was amazed to see Penny Wong talk about gay rights on Q&A recently. Someone who is working within the system. That takes alot of bravery, patience and fortitude. i could not do it

    On the a history lesson, I asked where does it work, not worked (briefly like Camelot).
     
  16. petershaw

    petershaw Junior Member

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    As you quoted,"The great English leader Winston Churchill once said,"democracy is the worst form of government except for the others";in a previous post.
    you then continue by making the point of how important voting is to democracy. However, history,( there's that word you keep using) tells us, your Champion wasn't all that keen to extend democracy to those he saw as beneath his station, or perhaps as a humanitarian was he just trying to protect them.History also shows us, that Churchill, as a politician ,also had a dubious background when it came to democracy and the british working class......Then, perhaps thats why you describe him as "the Great English Leader" I think it's most relevant even if it is not supportive of your world view.
     
  17. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    Debating the pros and cons of an historical figure has nothing to do with you voting or not voting.
    At least Churchill stood up and was counted--you hide in the shadows.
    Churchill did some good things and some bad things-- like us all.
    A lot of innocent people died because of Churchill--do you think he didn't know that?

    And please don't put words into my mouth
    Although I do agree with that quote, and know that 'we' would not have won WW2 without him-- again read some history.
     
  18. dannyboy

    dannyboy Junior Member

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    MA we obviously have differing opinions on this and that's a good thing of course! I disagree with your responses but rather than arguing about it I'm interested in what you perceive to have improved, deteriorated or stayed the same through the various governments that have held power over the years.
    dan
     
  19. ecodharmamark

    ecodharmamark Junior Member

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    Ahhh, now it is my turn to apologise for misreading your prior post. You would like to know where it 'works' (present tense), not where it has 'worked' (past tense).

    To the best of my knowledge, nowhere in our present time is there a society of thousands where a non-hierarchical form of political, social and cultural organisation prevails. However, I do know of dozens, if not hundreds of communities that do operate in this manner. Many eco-villages, housing/employment co-ops, group-homes, could be considered non-hierarchical in structure.

    History (that which has not been erased) does tell us, that every time an anarchist community (from any corner of the globe) reaches a number of a few hundred or more, the dominant political structure (take your pick) swiftly crushes it - and always by force! The previous examples I provided, are but a few of the many that litter the pages of (capitalist, communist, fascist, socialist, etc.) history

    Sad, but true. Still, we will keep trying.

    Peace, my friend, Markos.
     
  20. Michaelangelica

    Michaelangelica Junior Member

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    Yep, sorry i am so feral about this.

    I don't know the answer to your question, however I get many press releses from ministers on what they are doing. Mostly i have been impressed - especially by what Jenny Macklin (the Federal Member for Jagajaga and the Minister for Families, Housing, Community Services ) has been doing. None of this is reported in the press.

    It is easy to get disenchanted with bureaucracy, however the Feds., at least, seem to be more responsive and customer focused-in areas I know about like Centrelink- than they were 40 years ago.

    Most large organisations (over 100 people) have difficulty communicating. My experience with Govt has been better than that from my bank or especially Yank firms like Paypal Ebay Citybank, Amex etc

    And
    please don't read my signature unless it undoes all my arguing! :)
     

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