mulch material question

Discussion in 'Planting, growing, nurturing Plants' started by sindhooram, Sep 13, 2008.

  1. sindhooram

    sindhooram Junior Member

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    Hi - I am making a garden on some really low nutrient soil - that means that before I applied anything to it a pumpkin would grow 3 small leaves in 5 weeks and I dont know if you have ever seen bonsai beans but I hadn't!!

    Any way I have now made a mulch layer bed (newspaper, veggie scraps, cowdung, weeds all covered with banana leaves) which I am waiting to break down and I have applied cowdung to another area which is now doing better but is still far from full health. I have a compost pile going too but I'm waiting for that to break down more.

    I am interested in mulching the soil because my back isnt good for lots of digging and I like the concept, but I am a bit short of materials. I have banana leaves but I dont want to defoliate all the bananas, and also coconut fronds and husks which I think are good (the husks mainly) but I dont have a large enough supply for everywhere. I'm not too keen on newspaper although its a possibility.

    I was reading about mulching and it said that weeds make an excellent mulch if free from seeds. Here I have a PLENTIFUL supply of weeds (they dont mind the nutriend poor soil it seems) but when I have tried just throwing them on the soil after weeding , they just seem to keep growing and find a way to get their roots back in the soil. So what is the way to use them without that problem?? If I cut them down would that work? what plants are better than others?Are there any fast growing plants you can grow specially for mulch??

    Also what is the benefit of the compost pile if you are mulching? Can you apply it like a mulch rather than digging it in and should I wait to apply that first before applying any other mulch like banana leaves etc. ??How do you use compost if you have mulched already??

    Thank you very much as all these concepts are a little new to me....
    I have realy benefited from the answers I've been given so far for my other questions...also I hope that its OK to post here not being in AUstralia - i am in India!!! But I have visited and enjoyed that beautiful country!!
    Best wishes to all
     
  2. gardenlen

    gardenlen Group for banned users

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    Re: mulch material question

    g'day sindhooram,

    can you access any spoilt hay type mulches or sugar cane tops mulch anyone slash and fields of grass and let it lay? maybe get permission to rake some for your garden. the big dilemna for backyard gardeners is it is going to be very difficult to generate as much mulch material as the garden will need, just as an example (we don't feed with fertilisers or manures they are too hard to get or costly) in around 2.5 years we have bought around 200+ bales of mulch material into our yard most of which has gone on our around 16sq/meters of garden, along with that we also bought in around 200 bags of mushy compost to kick it off, now that medium has developed nicely so our ongoing feeding comes from those hay type mulches and our kitchen scraps as well as spent vege' plants being composted where they once stood.

    len
     
  3. SueinWA

    SueinWA Junior Member

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    Re: mulch material question

    Try laying the weeds in the sun for a day or two. That may discourage them from trying to sprout. Chopping it a bit, so it has less moisture reserves may help, also.

    Is there any kind of processing of organic materials in your part of India that is considered waste? Perhaps you could get a few loads of it, if there is any.

    Sue
     
  4. sindhooram

    sindhooram Junior Member

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    Re: mulch material question

    Thanks for that - I'm going to try that with the weeds in the sun....it might not be enough for everywhere but it'll be a start for a small area.
    I tried also putting kitchen scraps directly on the soil but so much gets eaten by ants if I dont cover it with weeds etc in the compost pile. Can you apply compost before it is fully broken down as mulch, or is that dangerous??

    I dont know about spoilt hay or sugar cane (I havent seen any sugar cane grown locally). The only thing is that here alot poor people with cows go around looking for materials to feed their cows and i wouldnt want to take from them. It is the same with coconut husks - I could ask for them from a seller but I know a lot of locals use them for their cooking fires.
     
  5. IntensiveGardener

    IntensiveGardener Junior Member

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    Re: mulch material question

    Hi,
    In answer to your question, yes you can use compost when it is only partly deceyed. It will not be as good in its ability to structure the soil but the nutrients are still there and it will continue to decompose in the soil.
    You can avoid having a compost pile and do all your composting in the garden bed's mulch but in my opinion doing both is probably the best bet. The compost pile undergoes a different decomposition to the organic matter in the mulch due partly to its temperature. This attracts a slightly different range of microfauna and soil life. It is good to think of the compost as the "leaven" and the mulch as the "flour". (forgive me, i'v been working in a bakery too long!) :)
    The compost can be added to a mulch by putting it on top and then covering it lightly with some organic matter (or even a bit of soil)
    I tend to put a layer of good compost on top of the newspaper, then build a mulch on top when i use this method.

    The best thing you could put on your garden would be the cow manure. Of course this too is better when composted but older cow pats make an A-grade soil conditioner and provide a good amount of organic matter and nutrients. maybe you can compost any fresh stuff and use the older ones straight onto the garden. If there is a plentyful supply of cow dung then you should need very little else.
    Other sources of material which would be no use to other people include: wood ash, fallen decidious leaves, wood shavings.
    cheers,
    ig
     
  6. milifestyle

    milifestyle New Member

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    Re: mulch material question

    If the weeds are growing in the area you are trying to build up - could be why the soil is drained. Weeds consume a lot of nutrients from the soil.

    I'd add a mixture of lawn clippings, leaves, and shredded branches etc over a layering of old newspaper and cardboard. When this has reduced down rake it over and plant directly in it without digging the soil.
     
  7. ho-hum

    ho-hum New Member

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    Re: mulch material question

    Sindoorham,

    What you are doing is fine. Mulch is best described as an un-composted layer. Always plant your first food requirement, albeit green leafy vegetables, also plant legumes. Even if the crop is poor, it is still remarkably worth eating. Do not think if you cant 'buy peanut, sugarcane,lucerne hay' that anything is lost. This is just city people relying on supermarkets, 'making do with what they can purchase'.

    We can all grow mulch. We can all scavenge or collect animal manures. The best strategy is to grow your [ongoing] mulch. Mulch is a compost food source. If you are on impoverished soils, mulch first, compost on site, and compost off site. This cycle does not take as long as many folk think. You are in a climate with a 365 day season. Use the seasons. Legumes are a good start. Leafy plants like gingers, helaconias, sugar cane etc can come next. There are also dozens of trees that can be radically harvested for their leaves.

    In the tropics, we cut down and recycle. This is the basis of tropical permaculture. Look towards local plants and herbs your best successes and experiments will reside there.

    Sind, in Australia we are always chasing the 'elements' of permaculture. I believe they exist within India. You are well positioned to make a permaculture point. Try, try and try again.

    PS... dont buy sugar cane tops or peanut hay. They are a product of our society, not yours.

    cheers,
     
  8. sindhooram

    sindhooram Junior Member

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    Re: mulch material question

    Hello - thanks for all those answers and filling me in on how to use compost and mulch.... I've just finished rereading them.
    I think that cow dung helps the soil a lot but I dont think its enough for such an impovrished soil because the plants still arent full strength - although I'm applying water soaked with cowdung too and its helping. My idea is that I need a good range of materials to get it really healthy.
    .
    I went to the beach the other day and saw some aquatic weed washed up (normally I dont see seaweed)so I collected that (probably the locals thought that a foreign girl collecting seaweed together with a long haired Indian man must be crazy) - my only doubt is if the salt content could be harmful - does anyone know anything about that??

    I dont have a lawn to use lawn clippings - its just too hard for me to maintain here. There are hardly any lawns here except in very big rich houses with servants. Instead I am encouraging a pretty small leaved clover to grow in a lawn area by removing the surrounding weeds and little by little I'm getting what to me is a pretty lawn although not conventional.

    If my mulch bed that I already made isnt fully broken down (its about half done I guess) can I make some gaps in it and plant some plants that I started in pots?? (tomato, Okra, cumin??) I was thinking to put a little soil and cowdung and then put them in and their roots should find there way into the mulch as it breaks down?? i am a bit impatient to get things going as the cooler time is coming (not such strong sun) and there is still some rain.

    Thank you!!!
     
  9. milifestyle

    milifestyle New Member

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    Re: mulch material question

    I would for sure. Your plants will be well fed as the mulch breaks down.
     
  10. barely run

    barely run Junior Member

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    Re: mulch material question

    there is a DVD advertised on this site and comes highly reccomended by others I know who are ethical people. One man, One cow, One Planet by Peter Proctor..it is on permaculture in India......may be there is a libary or college near you that might have it. It is about $30 australian.

    keep going with the cow dung and any weeds you can find you will have great results I'm sure.
    Cheers
    Cathy
     
  11. IntensiveGardener

    IntensiveGardener Junior Member

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    Re: mulch material question

    The seaweed shouold be well rinsed in fresh water before use. It is a great thing to add to the garden because it usually contains lots of trace elements and a range of nutrients from the ocean. The salt is a worry though but a good rinse should do it.
    The more diverse the composting material is the better, although its pretty much impossible to overdo the cow manure. Cows usually have a very diverse diet.
    Using cow manure, wood ash (in small amounts) and seaweed should provide a good balanced plant food for any garden. It just might take a while for your garden to come into full health and production. If it was impoverished from the start it probably just needs time to build up a humus base.

    You might also try this liquid manure recipy:
    1 bucket fresh cow manure
    1 bucket older cow manure
    1 bucket comfrey leaves / seaweed
    20 buckets water.

    Use a container with a lid.
    Mix the liquid well every day with a large stick.
    At first it will smell very bad and have a greenish color to it.
    When it turns black and loses the bad smell it is ready to use.
    cheers,
    IG
     
  12. milifestyle

    milifestyle New Member

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    Re: mulch material question

    I find seaweed to be good and can rinse naturally if left piled up over rainy periods. Put it in a pile over weeds you want to get rid of. The small amount of salt will help a little towards eliminating the weeds without turning your plot into a desert.
     

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