Beginning designing our permaculture home, on an island. Suggestions? Advice?

Discussion in 'Designing, building, making and powering your life' started by spud, Jul 17, 2014.

  1. spud

    spud Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2014
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I’m looking for some ideas on how to approach building our island home. We are trying to build the house as inexpensively as we can, and we are certainly open to unusual/alternative approaches.

    To give you some background on the situation, take a look at the attached mud map I’ve sketched up in MS Paint :). Our land is about 3 acres. The black lines represent the boundaries, the thin orange lines are contours. There is also a side-on sketch of the slope of the land.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    As you can see, it’s a sloping block, facing almost directly North (southern hemisphere).
    We want to position the house just over the edge of the ridge – mainly because there is a neighbouring house further up the ridge that we want to be out of sight of. This position has a very nice view, basically the same as that right on the top of the ridge.

    A few details about the site, and the island itself:

    Climate:
    *Mild, warm climate year round. Doesn’t get stinking hot, and doesn’t dip below 10-15 degrees C. Usually fairly humid and gets a fair bit of rain. There are no bush fires.

    Vegetation:
    *Block is mostly cleared and grassed

    Building materials:
    *There is plentiful local timber. It’s not cheap, but it is cheaper other conventional materials. Most locals build their homes out of timber, including timber floors, and use imported Colourbond for the roof.
    *Concrete is available, but very expensive.
    *Rocks are expensive and difficult to source in quantities.
    *Bricks and tiles are very expensive.
    *Glass is expensive. But this is one thing we’re willing to splurge on a bit, because we really want to have mostly glass across the North side of the house (mainly for the view, and also for the light). Double glazing is unnecessary given the mild climate.
    *Soil – the block has plenty of red volcanic soil

    Earth moving:
    *is reasonably priced on the island.

    Electricity:
    *There is no electrical grid connection available to the block. We plan to use solar + maybe wind and hydro (creek).

    Water:
    *Rain water for domestic purposes. We might build a shed up on the ridge above the house, so this could potentially allow gravity feeding the water to a tank, and then on to the house for drinking/showering/washing.

    The house – what do we want:
    *3 bedrooms.
    *1 composting toilet
    *1 shower
    *1 kitchen
    *1 dining/living area – adjoining the kitchen. This and the kitchen I think will go along the North side of the house, to get the best views and the sunshine.

    …That’s the bare basics we think we can get away with. Nice-to-haves include a mud room and maybe a study.

    We are going to be owner-builders, and we know a retired builder who has offered to give us a hand with building if we want it.

    So - suggestions on how you might go about building a house in such a place….let’s hear ‘em!
    I’m particularly interested in whether you would go for a conventional timber sort of house, or something different entirely?
    Also – any other general design considerations/ suggestions/ criticisms are most welcome!
     
  2. spud

    spud Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2014
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Here are the pictures

    Aerial view:

    [​IMG]

    Side view:

    [​IMG]
     
  3. spud

    spud Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2014
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    For some reason the images did come out above, here they are:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  4. S.O.P

    S.O.P Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2011
    Messages:
    1,456
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    38
    It really sounds like you have it all worked out already? Timber sounds like the go, and your winter temps look high enough to survive without need for extraneous insulation if it's difficult to procure.

    The higher you go up the slope, the more wind you are going to cop but if the view is important, then what can you do. Generally, it's recommended to put the house near the keypoint of the hill (check the Permaculture Design Manual for some recommended house sites). It's also recommended to have behind you well treed as cool air rolling down the hill can be moderated by them. Splitting hairs for what seems like, from your description, a worthy block. You mention no risk of fire as the steeper the hill, the faster fire moves by the order of 2.

    I'd solar and use the power you create during the day to pump water to big holding tanks up the top near the driveway. That saves on water pumping costs at other times of the day and for your gardens. If you can get the tanks, or afford the concrete to pour them.

    And I assume your gardens are going on the words, "nice view" and food forest beneath that? Since your house is a little high, and if those contours are accurate, you may have a short walk to the prime growing area. Looks like a good spot though.
     
  5. eco4560

    eco4560 New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2009
    Messages:
    5,925
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    0
    What skills do you have and what skills are available locally? That may have a bearing on what you can achieve. And of course the dreaded swear word of money….

    What building materials are available locally - on site even?
     
  6. bluesapphire

    bluesapphire Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2011
    Messages:
    95
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    what about shipping containers as your base....local timber decks all around....even 2 story to enjoy that view
     
  7. spud

    spud Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2014
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Thanks for the replies thus far.

    Hi S.O.P. - thanks for the tips! We're straying a little away from the slopes key point, in favour of a better view as I think you've guessed, but we certainly would like make sure we can still utilise many of the benefits you mention like elevated water storage, and trees on the topside to buffer against cool air (hadn't considered this). Yes imported water tanks are available, but darned expensive, so we are trying to get a bit creative about our water storage, such as using dams for the domestic water, or lining someones used leaky tank with a new liner.

    A typical timber weatherboard house is kind of our default option, but it is going to be more expensive than I'd like, even if we have all the labour for free, so we are very interested to see if anyone can suggest some alternatives we might consider.
     
  8. spud

    spud Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2014
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    My wife and I have never built a house, but I'm good with basic carpentry, metal work, and am generally pretty handy. The fella that will help us has built plenty of conventional houses before.

    Materials available on site include some timber (there are a few good pine trees that could be harvested in fact) and soil...I'm pretty sure that is all (unless I am missing something)
     
  9. spud

    spud Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2014
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    An interesting suggestion..I'll give this some thought!
     
  10. S.O.P

    S.O.P Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2011
    Messages:
    1,456
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    38
  11. eco4560

    eco4560 New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2009
    Messages:
    5,925
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    0
  12. Tasman

    Tasman Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2012
    Messages:
    37
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    6
    You have lots of fun ahead of you spud.

    We're about half way through putting up a house. Its on a north facing slope set amongst pasture and a bit of bush. Our ideas and house are not so much like yours, but there are some similarities. Though we are very happy with the way its going, there are already quite a few things we have learned along the way.

    1.) More than any other thing, take your time. If you're like us you're eager to get started. We spent a lot of time thinking about what we wanted (to great benefit). Then we rushed the design and plans submission to council (to considerable negative effect).

    2.) Consider something temporary at first. If I were doing it again, I'd build a shed, granny flat or put a caravan on our property first. Even though we spent quite a bit of time observing our property, there is no substitute for living on it (IMHO). In addition, we had little to no practical experience of building; so we could have made our mistakes/done our learning on a practice building ;-)

    3.) There is lots of good info out there to read. But you'll have to filter it quite a bit. Our house will be much better for having read: Making Your Home Sustainable by Derek Wrigley. this does a good job of explaining design decisions (for a cool climate - Canberra)

    4.) Remember, there is no universal right house. Your climate, land and needs are different from everybody else's. All those building materials and techniques are for solving problems. Make sure that by using somebody else's ideas you're not solving a problem you don't have.

    cheers,
    tas
     
  13. Mudman

    Mudman Junior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    69
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Hi there,
    Where is this island located?

    I am currently designing an earthbag house for a client with a very very tight budget but would require a relatively flat pad.
    Timber is always good, not sure if the pine trees would be suitable for building, depends on the species due to termites.

    Kurt
     
  14. spud

    spud Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2014
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Thanks for the suggestion. Not averse to such an idea at all!

    Thanks for the lessons learnt, tas! You make some very good points which have really hit home. I'm going to give some serious consideration to your suggestion - I might start by erecting a shed or residing in a shipping container for a while, then take my time designing the place. I think this will also give me an opportunity to (A) practice things (e.g. build and refine a trial composting toilet), (B) procure some used materials if I can (e.g. windows), (C) observe the environment/seasons/wind/light/sectors/etc.

    Earthbag is another option I'd be willing to consider. Does anyone have any further thoughts on this?
    Locals Tanalise the timber to stop it rotting (a kind of treatment that involves arsenic I believe, and is widely used in Australia), which I'm not especially comfortable with. If I do use it, I'll be restricting it's use to surfaces which humans shouldn't come in contact with very much, like beams, joists, framing and possibly the external weatherboards.
     
  15. Mudman

    Mudman Junior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2003
    Messages:
    69
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Spud
    Responded to your message
    Cheers
    Kurt
     
  16. bazman

    bazman Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2005
    Messages:
    802
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    0
    What about using an earthship design, can you find a local source of car/truck tires? You could cut it into the side of the hill. You could also use earth bags for forward or internal walls. https://earthship.com/construction-materials Low heating/cooling needs and the design is now well refined but flexible. You will find heaps of resources and videos on the web.
     
  17. TLP

    TLP Junior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2014
    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Since just about every local material source you listed is 'expensive', have you considered earth construction such as Rammed Earth, Cobb, or Adobe? Not sure what clay content your soil has below the top soil where you will excavate and have site soil to use, but red volcanic mixed with certain aggregates and natural pigments can produce beautiful sustainable walls that regulate humidity, store and breath temperature, work well with passive solar renewable energy if designed right, and much more. Straw bale homes would be another. You did not mention any building code restrictions so assuming the sky is the limit. If you can find a hemp farmer that is another great building material. That would at least limit your need for timbers, to cut cost you could debark yourself for you roof rafters or trusses. There are also light weight limecretes, or earthcrete roofs you can cast or pour if you have lime available, or pozzolanic materials like fly ash, magnesium and calcium oxides that can be used as binders. Hempcrete can also stabilize roof rafters from racking and provide high r-value walls and monolithic roof with mass effect. All these materials reduce odors with an interior smell that replicates the outdoor inside the home, especially clay. They are all low in green house emissions and voc's and dirt cheap if locally sourced.

    Since the mass walls mentioned above are anywhere from 12-24" thick, in your climate zone, I'd be surprised if you had any hvac load. If you did a rocket mass heater or rumford. Cooling, check into solar thermal (water tubes) pex on metal roof-to-radiant pex floors using solar heat and night time radiant cooling...beyond that an air source heat pump ductless mini-split single or dual zone depending on cost there if you have to go with a mechanical system. Your PV panel can run DC lights, if you can find low cost dc appliances great, use little AC to take down inverter cost. Solar thermal and PV roof panels work well together.
     
  18. spud

    spud Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2014
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Thank you for your detailed input! I'm planning to erect a temporary structure first, so that I can fully investigate all these options (e.g. rammed earth), whether suitable materials are available (e.g. tires), and additionally get a better feel for the landscape along the way. I will keep you all updated!
     
  19. eco4560

    eco4560 New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2009
    Messages:
    5,925
    Likes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Yes please! I'd love to know how you get on and what you end up doing.
     

Share This Page

-->